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[KH-18] Scales of Justice - Mafia Win!

semi-open 9-player

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#21
Lachiton

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No takers for doctor yet, eh? I am still sticking to both Cop and Doctor. Getting to save a townie sounds to me a much more valuable asset than Tracker, especially when a save or two can salvage the game for the town. Yes they are useless against strongman but so is tracker against ninja. Also the roles are unlimited, more so reason to me to stick with doctor.
Roleblocker is good too, can help town from scum kills but kind of double edged sword as he might invariably block town cop from investigating. Also mafia has already made their choice and they will try to confuse us to vote for the roles of their choice, so we should look out for that too :P


Are we allowed two votes for the townie roles, or just one?


We get to vote on two roles right?


Your role PMs should mention the number of votes you receive if you're a townie. ;)

Maybe they don't know how many votes they get cause they're not townies
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#22
SeaBeeGipson

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There are no hidden modifiers in this game.

 

Strongman will kill regardless of Roleblocker or Doctor.

 

Godfather fools the Cop.

 

Ninja fools the Tracker or Watcher.

Following this setup, I highly recommend others vote for the Cop/Tracker setup. A watcher would be a good setup as well, but I feel a Tracker would have more benefit than a Watcher.


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#23
KevinH

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Vote Count:

  • Cop - 3 : SeaBeeGipson, brewersalliance, Lachiton, 
  • Tracker - 2 : SeaBeeGipson, brewersalliance, 
  • Roleblocker - 1 : Lord MK, 
  • Doctor - 1 : Lachiton, 
  • Watcher - 0 :

Not Voting: iSocialism, King Cankles, Kitkat16, Rafay, vgmmaster
 



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#24
Lord MK

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@KevinH, is any of the role X Shot ?
If not then strongman has unlimited kills rendering a doc useless.
And so the mafia will use the strongman till there is doubt about the strongman in the eyes of the town.
Then they will shift to ninja kills.
They are not going to shift back to strongman after the night of doubt.

So roleblocker is useful in the mid game stage.

And the guy who appears neutral-townish and attacked violently by the scum meaning a quarter of the players will be the strongman so watcher seems a good bet.
But then it all depends on who is the watcher.

Then we have cop who is good against all except godfather who most probably will survive till the endgame and so the cop can work till then.

I will wait on my other vote till vgmmaster gives his take.
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#25
Lachiton

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I thought Mafia gets only one role and they have already voted on it pre-game



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#26
KevinH

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I thought Mafia gets only one role and they have already voted on it pre-game

 

^ what he said



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#27
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Vote: Cop

 

Hopefully he can give his findings before getting killed. Easily wasted best role imo.


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#28
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So we can two cops?
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#29
KevinH

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Vote Count:

  • Cop - 4 : SeaBeeGipson, brewersalliance, Lachiton, Rafay, 
  • Tracker - 2 : SeaBeeGipson, brewersalliance, 
  • Roleblocker - 1 : Lord MK, 
  • Doctor - 1 : Lachiton, 
  • Watcher - 0 :

Not Voting: iSocialism, King Cankles, Kitkat16, vgmmaster

 

So we can two cops?

 

Nice try, but no. Two of the roles will be chosen.



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#30
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Maybe they don't know how many votes they get cause they're not townies

 

 

:rolleyes: No, it was just genuinely unclear. "During the first Day, instead of lynching, all players will vote on two roles from the following list which will replace two random townies'." That is not clear whether it means that we place one vote each which counts towards the two slots, or whether we get two votes for the two roles.


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#31
vgmmaster

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I see that my thinking of X-shot possibilities from last night has been nullified by Kevin's clarification. Thanks for that, although now we don't have to over

 

No takers for doctor yet, eh? I am still sticking to both Cop and Doctor. Getting to save a townie sounds to me a much more valuable asset than Tracker, especially when a save or two can salvage the game for the town. Yes they are useless against strongman but so is tracker against ninja. Also the roles are unlimited, more so reason to me to stick with doctor.
Roleblocker is good too, can help town from scum kills but kind of double edged sword as he might invariably block town cop from investigating. Also mafia has already made their choice and they will try to confuse us to vote for the roles of their choice, so we should look out for that too :P

 

You're not wrong about the doctor being a powerful role. But with the strongman having unlimited shots, it essentially makes the doctor useless. One strategy is for the cop to come out with backing of a doctor and be safe until the doctor himself is killed (although at that point the cop is generally a dead man walking), but if the strongman negates the doctor, you don't want the cop outing himself into the public (without reason).

 

I'd be curious to see what everyone thinks the mafia took as their power role. While I'm undecided myself, I don't feel that the ninja was taken. Not that it can't be powerful in the right setup, but given the other two options, I'd say it's the least likely. Especially if the mafia knew that there was no X-shot modifier. That said, if I was mafia, I'd heavily consider choosing the godfather role. While I woudn't know what 2nd role the town would take, I'd place money on the cop being at least one of the roles and it would help negate the numbers game in what could potentially be a short game. Of course, the mafia could also worry about a potential town save by a roleblocker / doctor role and decide to make all their kills more or less guaranteed.

 

That said, here's my thoughts on roles that may be helpful from most to least.

 

Cop - Even with a godfather in play, he'll still be able to find one mafia via investigation

Watcher - If he targets a person the cop does, essentially clears two people at the same time for a powerful effect. If the mafia targets the same person as the watcher, it's essentially a revenge kill. Has the same backfire potential as the Tracker, but does so in a 50/50 matter as opposed to a "either / or"

Tracker - While he could find the cop or worse the non active mafia member (if both are still alive), would be a good backup and can be a lynchpin when only one mafia remains. Could also backfire if the mafia and cop target the same person.

Roleblocker - Not as effective with a strongman in play, but if there isn't one (or he's dead), gets powerful in the late game. Can block a late game kill and turn a bad situation into a town win

Doctor - Negated by a strongman. A powerful role but potentially useless depending on the mafia's power role choice.

 

I keep flip flopping in my mind what would be a better 2nd vote between the watcher and tracker, but I'd say a cop at the very least is a definite. I'd say I'm leaning watcher however for the aforementioned reasoning of it being more powerful than the tracker in the right situations.


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#32
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Wanted to do a second post for my other thought, partially as it came during the write up for my previous post. For whatever reason, it didn't dawn upon me until further consideration how powerful the tracker and watcher can be and I can see it's power being easily overlooked. If our mafia is well-versed, I could see them taking the sneaky route and going with a ninja as their power role.

 

That said, I think the power could be easily overlooked. Heck, I overlooked it myself last night which makes me glad in hindsight I didn't place a vote yet. With the power being of the more subtle variety that is why I think a Strongman or Godfather is the two likely options the mafia went with.


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#33
brewersalliance

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I agree that picking the doctor would be to big of a risk. If the strongman is picked the role is completely useless. Which makes me wonder when Lachiton was pushing for the role, perhaps strongman was picked. Just a thought idk


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#34
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I agree that picking the doctor would be to big of a risk. If the strongman is picked the role is completely useless. Which makes me wonder when Lachiton was pushing for the role, perhaps strongman was picked. Just a thought idk

Maybe, but I wouldn't put too much weight on it. It's worth mentioning that Lachiton did mention he's never played mafia before. If he did any reading beforehand to try to understand how the game works, he could have seen that the Doctor is one of the more common town roles (probably second behind cop?).


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#35
brewersalliance

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Lol I've never played before either


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#36
vgmmaster

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Lol I've never played before either

Fair enough. Coming back from the dead, I'll admit to not being familiar with who here has and has not played mafia. Between the way you've carried yourself thus far and my own presumptions, I just figured you had at least a little experience under your belt.


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#37
iSocialism

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Cop and tracker
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#38
King Cankles

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^ Cop n Tracker ^
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#39
Lachiton

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I agree that picking the doctor would be to big of a risk. If the strongman is picked the role is completely useless. Which makes me wonder when Lachiton was pushing for the role, perhaps strongman was picked. Just a thought idk

Not sure where you're going with this, but I have posted only after Kevin confirmed town can start voting since mafia chose their role, so my "pushing" for doctor cannot have any bearing on the role already decided.

 

I know Doctor is a very common role, most traditional mafia games have a combination of detective/cop and a doctor setup usually. As vgnmaster rightly pointed out, mafia must have considered cop to the be the numero uno choice of town, so godfather is the most likely role to have been chosen. So in that likelihood, doctor can actually save the cop who is the town's biggest asset. Strongman could have been chosen as well, but with doctor/roleblocker not a sure shot lock, ultimately the role would become useless. And though ninja seems to be the least likely chosen role, I have a feeling it might be the 2nd choice of the mafia. Mafia must have also thought that town will consider doctor/roleblocker somewhat of a risk given strongman on the cards, so generally we will go with the safer bet of tracker/watcher. So in that scenario with ninja, he can be the one doing the killing, hoping to eliminate cop and making tracker useless. With godfather, he would likely take a step back and and let the other mafia do the kills so as to not alert the tracker.

 

Basically above sums up my reasoning for doctor. Also it must be noted when I made that post, none of the voters expressed their thoughts on the choices they're making, except MK, so I just wanted to know hear other's thoughts on my choice.




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#40
KevinH

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Vote Count:

  • Cop - 6 : SeaBeeGipson, brewersalliance, Lachiton, Rafay, iSocialism, King Cankles, 
  • Tracker - 4 : SeaBeeGipson, brewersalliance, iSocialism, King Cankles, 
  • Roleblocker - 1 : Lord MK, 
  • Doctor - 1 : Lachiton, 
  • Watcher - 0 :

Not Voting: Kitkat16, vgmmaster
 



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