22 replies to this topic

[Sister Midnight]

I'm really curious as to how y'all would respond to a worst case scenario. If Don is shown to have colluded with Russia in election tampering, how will you react?

Also, if Hillary R. Clinton had won the election and the current real life situation (NOT my hypothetical, worst case scenario) were reversed, what would your reaction be?

[Davian]

Election Tampering = Impeachment

Still wouldn't want Hillary in charge.

[President Haze]

Not a trump or Hilary fan but I wouldn't support any president that had to pull any source to win an election.

[Lysistrata]

Why would you put this up as a poll? Would it not be enough to debate the issue? I think you're attempting to draw sides within IRON, and create support for your own personal hatred for the current President. Kinda smells bad SM, but it could be just me.

 

I voted "Other". This is because you really need to define what "colluded with Russia to interfere" means.

 

If it turns out that Donald J. Trump is really a Manchurian Candidate type Russian Agent sent in to destroy the USA from within... then that's treason and he should be executed... but if you believe that, you are as dumb as a lap poodle and right up there with those people that believe climate change will be the death of us all if we don't surrender our wealth to a new world order... oh sorry, no offense... really.

 

Do you believe Donald J. Trump colluded with the Russians to brainwash us to vote for him? See above.

 

Do you believe Donald J. Trump colluded with the Russians to rig voting machines to change votes? See above as well.

 

Donald J. Trump did not hack the DNC or John Podesta. Maybe the Russians did... we know somebody did... but it was not Donald J. Trump. The hacked documents were turned over to Wikileaks, and Wikileaks posted them as they always post everything. Everything Wikileaks posted... was true. It wasn't what I expected to be released, and I was very disappointed with what they did release. I was expecting Hillary Clinton's deleted emails... too bad.

 

Do you believe Donald J. Trump requested Wikileaks to release them after the Clinton camp colluded with NBC to release that 11 year old pussy grab video? I don't know, maybe, but guess what?... THAT'S NOT A CRIME!

 

Do you know what interfering with an election is? Interfering with an election is Barack Obama sending his election team headed up by his National Field Director, Jeremy Bird, and a ton of US Taxpayer money, to Tel Aviv to form an organization called "Victory 15". It was financed by "One Voice", an NGO that was funded by John Kerry's State Department. Their motto was "the voice of mainstream Israelis and Palestinians"... their mission was "Anybody but Bibi"... it failed!

 

That is interfering with an election.

 

So tell me what your version of collusion is?

 

Hillary Clinton was an awful candidate. She did something that was really hard to do... she lost to Donald J. Trump. That's a really bad candidate. I get the opposition party thing... but you guys are just looking like idiots out there.

[Sister Midnight]

I'm on my iPad, so elegant quoting is to hard.

Why would you put this up as a poll? Would it not be enough to debate the issue? I think you're attempting to draw sides within IRON, and create support for your own personal hatred for the current President. Kinda smells bad SM, but it could be just me.

It is just you. I made it a poll because I was in my doctor's waiting room and I found it entertaining to make a poll. Simple as that. Otherwise, I was pretty psyched to ask these questions because I am sincerely curious how peeps will answer and since this isn't my real life I don't need to be super careful about how this conversation will effect me.

I voted "Other". This is because you really need to define what "colluded with Russia to interfere" means.

My completely subjective definition: If Russia interfered with the election and Don knew about it and did not try to stop it by notifying the authorities or taking any serious action beyond asking to be kept out of the information loop, that would be collusion.

[Lysistrata]

My completely subjective definition: If Russia interfered with the election and Don knew about it and did not try to stop it by notifying the authorities or taking any serious action beyond asking to be kept out of the information loop, that would be collusion.

I always know Russia is interfering in our elections, and I never report it to anyone... am I colluding with Russia? Still the question is... how is that a crime? Donna Brazile, who worked for CNN, gave Hillary Clinton debate questions before the debate... I didn't see Hillary saying anything to anyone, or anyone charged with a crime... was she colluding to interfere with the election?

[Sister Midnight]

My completely subjective definition: If Russia interfered with the election and Don knew about it and did not try to stop it by notifying the authorities or taking any serious action beyond asking to be kept out of the information loop, that would be collusion.

I always know Russia is interfering in our elections, and I never report it to anyone... am I colluding with Russia? Still the question is... how is that a crime? Donna Brazile, who worked for CNN, gave Hillary Clinton debate questions before the debate... I didn't see Hillary saying anything to anyone, or anyone charged with a crime... was she colluding to interfere with the election?

I never said anything about any crime, why are you forever putting words in my mouth? And why don't you answer questions in a straightforward manner?

[Lysistrata]

I never said anything about any crime, why are you forever putting words in my mouth? And why don't you answer questions in a straightforward manner?

If you don't think there was a crime committed, then what's the point?

 

Your people are screaming for FBI investigations... the FBI investigates crime. Your people are pounding a never ending relentless drum for an independent prosecutor... they will never get it, because there is no evidence of a crime. There has to be a crime somewhere. The only reason they want an independent prosecutor is because it would hobble the Trump Presidency with a cloud for about 3 years... plus those guys never go away without prosecuting someone for something... the Valerie Plame thing found no crime, but they prosecuted Scooter Libby for lying to the FBI. If an independent prosecutor is appointed, all that will happen is 3 years and someone going down for lying to the FBI. Not worth it.

 

Comey got fired because he forced himself into the election... for nothing. He deserved it. Now, General Flynn may have done something wrong... he took cash from Russia when, I guess, he was told by Obama not to, and didn't tell anyone about it. It's why Trump fired him. I always thought he was kind of a big mouth, and I knew he would get in trouble somewhere. I think he's gonna get the book thrown at him, but... we have had an FBI that has made a lot of noise, and done nothing. That has to end.

 

Sorry about the question answering thing... these topics are not as cut and dry as a yes or no, but if there is a crime somewhere, I want the law enforced.

[Sister Midnight]

I started this thread because I was, and still am, interested in hearing viewpoints with which I am not that familiar. I question your ability to know anything about who "my people" are. You do a lot of assuming. I have not yet shared my opinion on Comey, on Russia, or on election rigging. I really would like to have an intelligent conversation with open minded people who may have views that differ from mine.

Many people are questioning In what way does Don dislikes Comey's conduct, He publicly condoned Comey's actions regarding Hillary and the election. Six months later, Don has been president for well over 3 months, and showed no sign of objecting to Comey or his election era antics. Upon firing Comey, Don initially flatly announced Comey isn't doing a good job, and that's why he was fired. He amended this later and made it about what Comey did with Hillary during the campaign. Some people have pointed out that he made it about Hillary only after there was a public outcry that his behavior looked very suspicious and comparisons to Richard Nixon were made. To make things look even worse to many, Comey had JUST requested more resources to investigate whether there was misconduct during the election. I am not condemning Don and accussing him of anything at the moment. I am stating facts, not alternative facts, facts.

Concerns of election rigging and misconduct are being raised about Don. The FBI INVESTIGATES crime. Election rigging is a crime. Allowing a foreign entity to control the outcome of a presidential election is a crime. How does the FBI find out if there was crime? By INVESTIGATING. That is what theFBI and law enforcement agencies do, they investigate potential crime. If they find evidence someone committed a crime they INVESTIGATE further. I cannot imagine why Lys has a problem with this. In America one is innocent until proven guilty, that doesn't stop both guilty and not guilty people from being INVESTIGATED. I don't know if any crime was committed, or not, and neither do you, Lys.

None of this has a lot to do with what I'm asking. My questions were to Trump fans, would they support him if it turned out he colluded with Russia to interfere with the election? I also asked how they'd respond if Clinton had won and had done the above? I made it very clear these are hypothetical questions. You asked me to clarify collusion, I have done so. I believe I've been very clear about what I've asked. I would like you to stop deflecting, distorting, and attempting to derail the topic, Lys.

[Lysistrata]

Oh yeah, I know who your people are... I had dinner with 3 of them last night. Same subject - Same result.

 

There has to be evidence of a crime to investigate. Hillary Clinton losing an election is not evidence that something nefarious was going on. Let's see... hiding her emails on a private server, destroying those emails, mishandling classified information, creating a fake charity foundation to bankroll a 2 billion dollar campaign war chest, sitting on her hands while 4 Americans including an Ambassador are killed, and then lying to the families, and the entire world, about how a video caused it, calling half the country deplorable, passing out and getting face planted into the back of her armored car... well none of that could have been the problem.

 

It must have been the Russians.

 

I'll tell you what... you make this stuff stick and I'll trade a non-conservative New York billionaire for an Indiana Governor any day.

Do we have a deal?

[Davian]

[King Cankles]

^^^^^^

[President Haze]

Me in real life.... But can't we just all get along here? Lol. Politics and religion always bring heated debates.

[Lord MK]

I am not for Trump or anti Trump ,hell i am not even an american or Russian

But i want to ask a question,.

Let just say that Russia did hack those emails,
Its not a crime or an act of war, if it was america would have been at war with atleast 20 nations.
America have a proven history of rigging elections so that candidates favourable to it won elections.
What do you have to say on this?

Another thing,
The hackers did not directly rig the elections, they put out the emails that's all.
And none of those emails are fake, even Hillary never denied this.
Ultimately the people of the nation were the one who decide whether to trust it,
no one know definitely that whether these emails were the reason for trump's victory ,it may or may not have influenced the electorate .
So any one arguing that the people were wrong?

One another thing, Americans have a history of not electing a woman president.
The male patriarchal instinct of americans will have never allowed a woman to rule them.

[Lysistrata]

SLMK... You and I have found common ground my friend.

 

The USA has influenced elections all over the world. We have incited rebellions, staged coups, installed puppet governments, and even used the most horrific weapon at the time on Japan for the purpose of actually saving lives. These are not conspiracy theories... we have actually done this... and I'm sure it was all done for the "greater good". That's all opinion I'm sure, but usually the opinion with the biggest biceps normally wins. We have really big biceps.

 

Most of what is going on over here right now is theater. While the show is playing, we are still running the country. We have not had a woman President yet. It doesn't mean we refuse to elect a woman... it just means the right one hasn't earned enough support yet.

 

Carry on Sir.

[Lord MK]

Well, it seems it is so.

I am ready to take any sides, but the reason why i hate the left is because of their tendency to go wild when someone give valid and strong statements aginst the left.
Another thing is that they tend to call that person hitler or someone on those lines and quit the debate.

Why can they just fight the fight?

[Lysistrata]

Why can they just fight the fight?

Well my friend... it's just real messy.

 

The left for the most part, hates the US Constitution. They love it when they need it... but really they would rather trash the whole damn thing and do whatever they want... at their whim. Their current whim is to suck the life out of the wealthy, and disarm the population.

 

We're affectionately called "Right Wing Extremists" by the opposition, and we base our political positions on the US Constitution and the Law. This is the real problem for the left, because you can never lose with the law on your side. If you don't like the law, you have to change the law. To change the law, you have to have public opinion on your side. If you can't get public opinion on your side, you have to rely on an activist Judge to sidestep the Constitution with some contrived ruling, and change the law by decree, and then it has to pass muster with a panel of a few un-elected people in black robes... that all have their own opinions.

 

So this is the meat of the matter, and why the left will lose their minds every time. If they can't win... they throw a tantrum.

[iSocialism]

Simple put. The FBI should come out and say that they found him to behave in a reckless manner, but no charges are going to put forward. Though if it was anyone else they would recommend the charges. But all this is just a fantasy IMO

[onbekende]

Why does any opposition automatically have the position of "destroy all!"?

[Lysistrata]

Why does any opposition automatically have the position of "destroy all!"?

Because Donald Trump won the election. They are so embarrassed and pissed off that they are throwing bombs in every direction. It doesn't matter at what, or at who, or how unreasonable... they have completely lost all touch with reality. I don't think it's gonna get better.