vgmmaster

You mean 5 minutes, and it shouldn't. Deadline time would be final. That said, we'd be in twilight. A lynch or non-lynch is final, but we could still discuss until the thread is locked for night 2.

Lego - Out of the role options, 1 shot PGO means paranoid gun owner. No. Warrior and Canik are both at 3.

If Lego is indeed town, he could have picked that role group in an attempt to get the doctor role. Still, a roleblocker can be beneficial for the town, since if there's during the night, that would be a high chance of the roleblocker having found scum (not 100% as the mafia could refuse to night kill in an attempt to play mind games). Lego visiting Robert... *re-reads the day 2 opener* With Robert stopping his vehicle, I can see where one might think that Lego roleblocked him. That said, Robert is not the driver of the Prius. The Prius belonged to Kitkat as he was the tired writer on his way home when he was stopped dead in his tracks.

How do you figure Lego was attacked? There was one death last night, and the only other potential way for there to be a night kill is if the one shot vigilante would have used their night action. It's possible they targeted Lego (or the mafia target Lego and vig killed Kitkat), but being a one shot, it wouldn't be wise to waste it on night 1. IF Canik targeted Lego with a role (regardless if it's jailkeeper or not), we can presume that Lego is at least not a paranoid gun owner. At this point, Warrior and Canik are both one vote away from a lynch. We got a claim from Warrior. Might not be a bad idea for Canik to claim at this point as he may be dead in an hour.

Canik hasn't roleclaimed. However, he did post this back on post #459: So while there hasn't been a claim officially, it can potentially be deduced if he has a role and what that role is. Of course, considering any role can be town or scum in this game, that does only help so much.

We have a little under 3 hours until deadline. While I am thinking Canik is the scummier one between him and Warrior, I think general consensus (not that everyone agrees mind you) is that one of these two is scum. I'm not sure if we can get two votes for Canik in such a short time frame, but one for the warrior would be easy enough, especially if one switches their vote. Regardless, if that is indeed the general consensus, I don't think we can afford a no lynch here. Especially if we're right.

Between the two choices we have available, we have the vanilla Warrior, and the power role (most likely) Canik. Taking them at face value, Warrior has claimed multiple times that he didn't know how the roles were distributed, which makes the vanilla claim believable. Canik on the other hand, has been cryptic and I think if we lynch him, we'll have to look a lot closer at some others, ESPECIALLY if he flips as scum. Vote: Canik Possible scenarios that could play out if Canik flips as scum: We can already determine (most likely) that Frigid is either a cop or role cop thanks to the pm fiasco. The fact Frigid voted and unvoted Canik quickly and wants us to not lynch him so he can investigate Canik himself could be an attempt to take heat of a scum buddy. Being all "I'll investigate him, don't worry guys" so we'll all look the other way. Lego referring to Canik's post #459 where Canik claims to have info on Lego. It could just be the way Canik has read Lego's posts, but that post in particular is what leads me to believe Canik to have a power role. I was debating on divulging this info, but I'm thinking Canik is either a neighbor or more likely, a jailkeeper. I'm not sure if the neighbor role can talk to his other neighbors as there is no mention of that in the rules like there is mafia communication which leads me to skeptical for that role, but jailkeeper could give Canik faith of Lego being town. Problem with relying on the jailkeeper role in that regard, Lego could be scum who didn't send in the night kill (provided the scum has to choose a specific person to send the kill). Lego does say he doesn't want Canik to divulge that information. Maybe in fear of it getting out if Canik or Lego turn up as scum? Could be Lego buddying up with Canik? Also keep in mind Lego is attempting to start a bandwagon on The Warrior who currently sits at one vote away from a lynch (and not being lynched already as Lego mistakenly thought). As of right now, I think either Warrior or Canik could be scum (although leaning more town for Warrior right now). That said, even though he is likely a PR, Canik's death could give us a whole lot of possible juicy intel.

Always a bridesmaid, never a bride. <3

If you're implying what I think you are, it might be a good idea for a role cop to investigate you to verify if you live through the day. That said, it doesn't clear you (or Lego) and the role I'm thinking you're talking about could actually be quite dangerous in scum hands.

What exactly is wrong with us lynching Canik and you picking someone else to investigate during the night? I agree something seems off here. I'm willing to believe that you're either the cop or role cop, but that doesn't necessarily mean you're town either after making a post like that.

And Canik, you're right. I have been uncharacteristically quiet compared to my last two games. While I'd like to say that I'm scum hiding in the shadows, this week has unfortunately messed with me quite a bit mentally. And if you'll notice, I've been very quiet in the Star Wars game as well. Which I'd like to apologize for my inactivity. I'm hoping after this weekend, my mind can clear up just a bit better. OOC: Long story short, I'm going to a funeral tomorrow. The death is one that I've expected for a little while now, but doesn't exactly make it any easier. If for some reason, you don't believe me, you can ask Davidrbr as he requested an interview earlier this week oddly enough and I had to tell him right now was not a good time.

Interesting turn of events in the past day or so. Unvote Earlier in the day, my gut was telling me there was scum between The Warrior and Brewers. While I don't want to say I'm less sure of that now, I'm getting more positive vibes from Brewers at this point (I think). The Warrior brings up good points about Canik in post #416. Canik starting the wagon and then jumping off in the 11th hour is interesting and then using that narrative to paint GoidIron's lynchers in a negative light is a red flag for sure. While I can see where Canik is coming from in some of his points, the backpedal is interesting to note. In fact, while Canik does seem scummy with the backpedal and throwing shade at the beginning of day 2, TW's narrative is just as interesting in creating a convincing story to try and lynch Canik. Unless I misread something though, I don't know if I see how TW's post is an attempt to save isoc, so it seems Kevin is grasping at straws there. Please correct me if I'm wrong and did miss something though. Something to note as well: Unless Frigid saw something in Canik's rebuttal (post #420), why would he unvote Canik? As of right now, Canik is in no danger of being lynched. Why not keep the pressure on him, even if you won't be around? If something puts Canik in a more positive light, the more active among us can switch our votes elsewhere.

On the contrary Kevin, doing a no lynch allows the mafia to hide easier. You can never rely on the power roles, as A) you don't know if they exist (especially in an open setup) and B ) even if they do exist, they could always die on the first night which negates any potential benefit you would have gained from waiting. Lynching and then investigating those lynches is a power the scum can't take away from us. The only people who can take that power away is the town itself (not counting special roles like the governor). I understand you've been indoctrinated long ago for the side of no lynching. I just don't want you using reaper powers to indoctrinate the rest, especially the newer players.

Seeing these recent no lynch votes to end the day. With (possibly) two scum groups floating around, is that really such a wise idea?

Nah im pretty sure im the dead one here both sbg and rafay have been super silent, i mean kit the ghost has almost said more than them this day i also like the fact that brewers and i combined nearly outnumbers the other member's 64 ours to 65 everyone else For some reason thought Warrior posted more. Crazy to see some of those numbers spelled out in that way though. Regardless, I wouldn't say it's a guarantee you're dead tonight. IF there is a doctor, he'd be wise to protect you if you are indeed the cop. Of course, we could have no doctor. But if the mafia believe there's a doctor, sometimes that's all you need to survive. Now, if we happen to lynch the doctor / roleblocker tonight, then yeah, you're probably boned. I don't think anyone is doubting that. I could be wrong, but I think a scum role cop is actually more common than a town role cop. Of course, alignments are all sorts of crazy in this game. At the very least, we know it's a 50/50 shot of there even being a role cop in this game.

This is a very good point and furthers my thoughts before about there potentially being two scum on the wagon. TW: I have already expressed my concerns about him and why I think he might be scum Lachiton: Hasn't really given off a scummy vibe, but not a super townish one either. And frigid said he thinks Lach is innocent. If you saw the accidental PM from frigid, my thoughts on this would make a little more sense. Basically, either lach is legit innocent and has been cleared by frigid, or lach is scum, and they developed the accidental PM as a ploy to make people think lach is inno. Basically frigid accidentally says he is investigating lachiton in the group PM chat so everyone can see it, then deletes it to make it look like a mistake, and then says he thinks lachiton is innocent, which in turn would make everyone who saw the mistake think Lachiton is indeed innocent via the results of the investigation, when in fact he is actually scum. If someone out there is actually the cop and it isnt frigid, then you would be able to verify that that was indeed a ploy, thus making it extremly likely that lachiton and frigid are both scum. I dont think this hypothetical plan of theirs would be very likely to actually have ahppened though, because it would be a huge risk if there was an actual cop would could easily counter this claim. However is scum have the cop role, it could be a very strong attempted deception. So I am suspicious of this, but not enough for a vote or an FoS. Legoboy: Has acted fairly townish to me so far. Nothing out of the ordinary in my eyes that screams scum. Isoc. Was the hammer, and joked about wanting to be the hammer. Could have used the joking nature to cover the fact he was scum trying to make sure a townie died, and for the most part he has been fairly inactive without contributing much and back to the frigid lach thing, now that I think of it, if frigid was really inno and accidentally outed himself via the pm, why on earth would the scum have allowed him to live through N1? It would have been a huge risk, since the scum could have easily gotten a kill on a town power role and eliminated the chance of them being outed via the power role. Therefore: FoS both Frigid and Lachiton I'd have to agree with The Warrior that I think the pm fiasco was a mistake. He also mentioned some different scenarios, so we just now have to ask ourselves if we believe him to be a town cop or mafia cop. That said, I don't believe it would be wise for a cop counterclaim on the off chance that Frigid is a role cop and is believing Lachiton to be innocent based on a role claim result. To answer your question about Frigid staying alive through night 1, my guess would be that all night action submissions are final. So if scum sent in their night kill as soon as possible, they'd have no chance to change it later if something came up in the case of Frigid. A few things about that. While you do raise a good point that it would be against the rules, perhaps as a new player he would not have known it was a violation, and as MK previously stated with the Kitkat situation, when we were curious what would have happened if kitkat did violate the rules, MK said he would handle it privately with kitkat. Therefore i think its safe to assume that if it was a ploy MK would have handled it privately with frigid, thus making it still possible it was a ploy. Of all the people to come to the defense of someone I am suggesting might be scum the first to defend frigid is TW, who is also someone I suggested as scum. While im sure that is just a coincidence, I do find it interesting. A few more thoughts. if frigid is indeed innocent, TW suggesting Frigid confirm he is indeed the cop would almost ensure his lynch by the mafia. While he is trying to make it look like a friendly suggestion to the town, TW would be virtually sealing the fate of frigid if he admits it. That to me is pretty scummy. Yes Yes I know I was the first one to bring up the PM mistake, but plenty of us saw it, and my intention was to talk about the fact that it might be fake. And if frigid is indeed scum, and therefor would not die at night, TW has also created a reason for why the town should keep frigid alive: by suggesting that frigid is being role blocked and framed by the scum. and also to further my point about TW asking Frigid to confirm he is the cop. Lets consider frigid for a moment being scum. He could admit he is the cop, and end up being scum as the cop. OR perhaps scum has the role of 1-Shot Redirector which in turn would prevent there from being a cop, and frigid could saftly admit it without a potential counter claim. So even if Frigid is scum, TW has coverage with trying to paint him as town by admitting he is the cop Having not seen the deleted PMs, I can't attest to how they were worded, but if Frigid was a Redirector, I don't think he would "investigate". Unless it was a lapse in wording.

I do agree with you there. Since drug dealers are typically considered bad guys, would it be reading into it to much to assume the role is an evil version of the fruit vendor? Or is it perhaps just a way to make the role seem more fun and less lame? If it was Lord Sunday I would argue that its just a typical night, but SeaBee is totally a responsible human and would never do drugs unless someone sold them to him in a mafia game ofc I don't believe that to be incorrect. I could see Fruit Vendor / Neighbor being high on the list. While the fruit vendor role would be a bust (to my understanding of it), the neighbor role could be very powerful in mafia hands. A mafia member in two factions could be more dangerous than usual.

I go for day one no lynches every game. I have a different school of thought then him though. Scum laying low wouldn't somebody not saying anything be laying low? Not necessarily. While you are correct that an inactive scum could be lying low, that doesn't mean it's always correct. While it sounds backwards, a highly active mafia member could be lying low in the sense that people wouldn't expect them to be as active. However, I think what Canik is getting at is that by voting no lynch, there's no vote history. There's no pressure.

The fact that the flavor text has deeper meaning makes things interesting. I don't know how much we'll be able to decipher until day 3 though by looking at possible repeating events and such. Everyone's been focused on the night 1 flavor text, but disregardingeverything else. While there isn't much in the intro to go off of, it does specify crime AND drugs. With SBG running around naked and high during night 1, it could signify that he was targeted by a fruit (drug) vendor. Or it could be a typical Tuesday night. Reading this, to me, the first paragraph signifies the activities of last night. But the interesting part is the "11 hours later". I don't think that necessarily happened at night. While it's difficult to deduce a power role either being used by or on Robert, it reads more as "the beginning of day 2". If we want to read it at face value however, I'd be inclined to believe we have at least a roleblocker or jailkeeper in play for sure. We already know the roles are random, so it's quite possible we have no doctor. Reading the interaction between The Warrior / Brewers is intriguing as well: This reads to me as super defensive. Saying that you were framed by the mafia, or at the very least, being given undue attention. I wouldn't think you'd have a lapse of judgement to make a mistake like that (as you claim), but it could be an attempt at reverse psychology. HOWEVER, I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt for now. As while the back and forth is interesting, I think Brewers is the one who needs the spotlight. A lot of people have a lot of explaining to do. Terrible that KitKat got killed. He was targeted due to his activity most likely. Idk why what I wrote showed up in the middle of the quote bubble but let's try that again: Or KitKat got lucky when he made the joke about who was mafia and one of them was, so they wanted everyone to know KitKat was town right away to remove suspicion off them as it was clearly just a joke now Emphasizing Kitkat's joke post early in the game where Kitkat claimed he, Robert, and The Warrior were scum. 1) correct there cannot be a commuter 2) he was probably targeted by the fruit vendor and ate the fruit which was tainted with drugs I still think either TW or Robert is scum, since Kitkat was very controversial, so the scum could have easily left him alive to be lynched, and the only reason I can think of is that he was actually right with one of them being scum, and kitkat was drawing attention to them with his jokes. Right now im leaning more towards it being TW. He was driving to work at night, and who does work at night? vigilantes work at night (Batman). I think TW was playing dumb about not knowing how the power roles are asinged, and he has a killing power role and is indeed scum, thus trying to throw us off his scent. Vote: TW Obviously we now know Kitkat's post was a joke. However, Brewers is coming off as overly adamant with constantly bringing it up. On day 1, while the theory was flawed of lynching KK, I could see the logic behind thinking it. I'd think if the mafia were truly afraid of Kitkat, they'd be better of ignoring him with the claim that, "oh, it's Kitkat. He's a joker. Don't take him seriously". The fact that you're still on this train of thought reeks as pushing an agenda and the train is about to derail. Vote: BrewersAlliance

Just because Kevin is the mod doesn't mean you have to vote a no Lynch in his place.

Welcome Jazzman. It's been touched upon by others, but self preservation doesn't put you in a positive light. Is it a newbie though? Only asking this as while I don't recognize your name personally, I've been away for a few years so a number of people here I haven't played with. That said, for now at least, my vote stays. FoS Robert2424 and anyone saying brewers is scum based on that. You have no reason to do so. It is only day 1... and nothing of value has been posted except by jazzy. I get you don't like having the ost votes. But voting on samus to try to get him lynxhed before you are is bound to backfire. You could have posted something of value and most people would have unvoted. You are either a jester or most likely scum. Vote Jazzy95 Just inc case I unvoted, too lazy to go back and check It always bothers me when people say they're too lazy to check something. It's one thing to not be able to via time constraints, but to outright not do it because of laziness bugs me. If you're alive later in the game, that means you must be scum as well right? Is you dying early in the game still a thing or was that only from way back in the day? Does this mean Sister Midnight won't be able to stay naked with all the cold weather?

​Even if we don't get much info from power roles today I don't think that justifies your decision. You may have cost us a day at the end of the game (if someone could do the math on that it'd be awesome).. and we probably will get some help from power roles. So your arguement there, while pretty, is weak IMO. It's difficult to provide math in the technical sense as we could have up to two vigilantes floating around (or then could be a PGO / Vengeful townie). Ignoring power roles though, it looks a little like this: With zero no lynches: Day 2 - 12 Day 3 - 10 Day 4 - 8 Day 5 - 6 With a no lynch: Day 2 -13 Day 3 - 11 Day 4 - 9 Day 5 - 7 Provided we're following the basic setup of 11 Townies and 3 Mafia, Day 5 would be a game over provided we hit zero scum all game. That said, with the additional killing power roles (which may or may not be on the town side), the numbers aren't that cut and dry.

First of all: FOS Frigid I don't get email notifications so while I saw part of that whole thing, I don't know what it was all about. Not voting for now as that could be anything. As for GoldIron, it sucks we lost a watcher, but there's a chance we have a backup watcher presuming that person picked the universal backup role. Of course, the alternative for that role choice was a role cop, so that's not a given. Will have to think more when I'm not sneaking into the bathroom at work to post, but I wonder if the mafia fell for whatever Kitkat's bait was or if it was something more nefarious. FOS Isoc. Wanting to rush a Lynch in the 11th hour is scummy in wanting to ensure the death of someone day 1.

But I thought you couldn't vote for yourself.

I believe the only people that have yet to post are Jazzman and Robert? In all fairness, the theme is just for story purpose and in theory shouldn't have any bearing on the game. That said, with a source material as rich as Star Wars (along with the size of this game), all bets are off when it comes to potential roles. As for number of scum, I'd say two teams is a fair estimate for sure. Wouldn't be surprised to see an X-shot killer as well such as a vigilante or a third party as well (not necessarily a killing group / person). Perhaps the Cantina band is a cult group looking to expand their band and take over the world with their music. Only scum know who scum are on the first day. So, you should want to present it as a lie. But you're trying to deceive the town as well by your lies. Therefore you are a jester. Setting your self up to get lynched, Or in this universe, jar jar binks. If there is a jester and it is Jar Jar, I'm fine with a second place finish in that case.