346 replies to this topic

[Kaziocore]

I think something is wrong with you Tracker as
you were gone for 8 days without even posting and
then suddenly when someone voted you, you immediately
posted so that means you're deliberately reading the thread
without actually posting which means you are lurking.

And revenge voting will not do good for you.

[ccabal86]

Preston said he won't have a lot of time on his hands, so that might explain his lack of long posts (he always makes long posts regardless if he's town or mafia, so i don't think this is a good indicator)

Anyway, I believe "follow the cop" is only a good strategy if players are generally active, so it might not work here. For all we know the cop may be inactive and we can wait for eternity. I suggest we lynch an inactive.

[Tracker]

I'll take a break from the RP for a little bit. Might get daunting to keep them coherent if I have one every time I post.

'Gone' implies that I was not here. I have been here, reading each message as it comes in; I have merely neglected to post. Silence does not equal inactivity. But regardless! As I alluded to in the RP, I am new to IRON Mafia games. Each community has its own way of conducting these games and their own flavors, and I have found that mostly observing on the first day to learn these traits is crucial. If one fails to learn these traits, you are lynched in short order due to the fact that you are acting 'different and therefore suspicious'. Granted, I love acting different to stir things up but I don't enjoy being killed.

That being said, I suppose I'll have to break my own rule and start contributing a day early. Now, looking at this from a Mafia perspective, their goal is to survive long enough to win, correct? They do this by either ensuring a no-lynch occurs (through no-lynch votes or failed consensus) or that a non-mafia gets lynched each day. In either scenario, they want doubt to be cast upon anyone and everyone in the game which in turn means that lynching would be less accurate than hoped. Therefore, their goal is to kill anyone who would be above suspicion or be less likely to be suspected, as these people worsen the Mafia's odds of not being lynched. As a non-Mafia, one obviously does not want to be lynched and therefore effort should be taken to prove loyalties. However, to avoid rising above and being weeded out by the Mafia, one must never be truly innocent appearing and instead by ever so slightly suspicious. That way you avoid lynching by not being overly suspicious, but you avoid midnight assassination by being ever so slightly suspicious.

That's my take on how a non-Mafia should play (not taking into account roles). It may not directly benefit the town to the maximum effect, but it is certainly self serving. So in conclusion, that should mostly answer your questions. But should it ease your worries? Perhaps... but I was just a hint suspicious with this little explanation, was I not?

(And yes, I'm aware that I voted for no-lynch and just said that is in the Mafia's best interest. As a few others have alluded to, lynching on the first day is just wild mass guessing and usually doesn't yield a success.)

[BeeBs]

Greetings gentlemen,
I have certainly not deleted my account. Unfortunately, CyberNations support is under the impression I had two accounts. Why this is the case I am uncertain, but I'll just need to start up again. It isn't too much hassle, my account was only a couple days old at the time. I just moved into a new apartment and haven't had time to set up my nation again. Oh, and thanks for withdrawing your votes on me after I signed in. Anyway, enough with the disclaimer, just didn't want you to count me out.

I'm inclined to agree with Tracker. I suppose not posting is not the same as being inactive, but it sure doesn't do any of us much good if we can't hear your thoughts or reactions. From what I can gather the mafia are trying to maintain a no lynch strategy. It seems like they could all hog pile (in a sort of subtle hog pileish way...) on a candidate, which they most certainly aren't doing. I mean, it would seem like they have a plethora of defenses on day one to justify a bad lynch. They could simply say they just want to get a vote record or that they had nothing to go on and a vote was better than no vote. There are a few other flimsy excuses as well, but enough that there wouldn't be enough to immediately turn around on them. What I am thinking is that the mafia are trying to spread things around a bit, trying to keep the town from voting at all. They get a free kill at night, and no one can go on anything on the second day. I am weary about dropping a vote on someone in my first post, I think that would be a little hasty. However, if I were voting I suppose I would lean towards CanucksDynasty. While I don't personally know his playstyle, if some of you do and consider it suspicious that he has changed it dramatically that might warrant some suspicion. I mean it isn't proof, but it seems like something to go on. Drawing mafia isn't very frequent, and neither is dropping ones commitments to a strategy that seems pretty in favor of the town. I mean, its only a correlation and I have no personal experience with his play style, but it seems to me like the most relevant vote cast so far. Can anyone else verify this or comment on it.

I guess I should also suspect those that had a vote on me as well. In addition, to be consistent, I would also consider those currently voting for a no lynch. From what I gather that is typical for KevinH, so it is hard to gauge suspicion based on that. A clever strategy for those times that he is mafia perhaps? Tracker as well, maybe you could demonstrate your activity with a vote or explain what kind of Day 1 evidence could ever justify you lynching on the first day.

Kaziocore: Seeing as Tracker has made a good faith effort to justify his activity, would you consider switching to CanucksDynasty? Why or why not?

With a little discussion and foundation I would be willing to put my vote there, but I'm not comfortable jumping in and placing on a second vote, the first legitimate second vote (as the two on me weren't) of the game.

[Tracker]

I think I've only ever seriously voted for someone on the first day once before, and that was only because the person made (what I thought to be) a serious gaffe. We voted to lynch and got a lucky first day Mafia kill.

If something like that were to happen this game I would consider voting for said person. But as no one has done so yet and I don't expect anyone to, my No Lynch vote will most likely stand. We simply lack any real proof to finger a suspect, and since this is my first IRON mafia game I don't know each individual's history.

[Kaziocore]

Replying to both Tracker and BeeBs:
Yes I agree that reading the posts but not posting is not being inactive.
It's called lurking which is actually worse because the mafia can do this
to refrain from posting (posting means possibility to slip-up or get noticed
by the general public) and when they're noticed, they can just tell the
excuse that they're inactive (which really happens).

And to answer BeeBs's question, I generally don't vote for active players
very early in the game as I rather target first the inactive ones (but
exceptions can be made if necessary). The cop can investigate
the active ones. You can read my previous posts why I think we should
lynch the inactive people instead of choosing no lynch.

My current vote for Tracker will stay as he really did lurk.
It will stay until I find his activity acceptable or see another suspect.
But see, I made him post and I hope it will do good for the town.

Also how would you know an individual's history without
voting? Everything starts with a random vote somewhere
and then paranoia falls in and we now have a mafia game.

[Kaziocore]

And I think I saw Nerau reading this thread today...

[reign of terror]

This day ends at 5 pm cn time on Monday the 11th since the activity has picked up a bit.

[KevinH]

Hey, there are some posts to read!

I don't mind an extension as long as posts are getting made. And if we don't end up with a lynch.

Do the scum want one less townie alive? Yes. They will push for a lynch.

Do the scum want to make it look like they are townies? Yes. They will push for a no-lynch.

Just because someone is supporting no-lynch does not make them any less of a scum candidate (myself included).

Ultimately, though, the town will be better off if there is there is one more of them. Regardless of the reasons behind the occurence.

[Kaziocore]

Do the scum want one less townie alive? Yes. They will push for a lynch.

Do the scum want to make it look like they are townies? Yes. They will push for a no-lynch.

Preferably scum A will choose the first, scum B will choose the second,
and scum C will lurk all day and pretend they're inactive.

[d3mon]

I agree with Kaziocore, lurkers are more likely to be scum.

ATM, I am leaning towards no lynch. Last round was ample proof that a lynch on Day 1 can be really bad for the town.

FOS : CD and Tracker

[BeeBs]

Alright, well if no one else responds that CanuncksDynasty's change in attitude should rouse suspicion than I suppose I don't have much of a case. I can't push myself since all my knowledge of his playstyle is second hand and could very well be a mafia ploy. On the other hand, I am not much interested in a no lynch. I don't see how it puts us in any better position to make votes on the second day. At what point do we stop waiting around? What makes a vote on the second day any less random than on the first?

It sounds like you guys are pretty keen on this lurking bit. I don't necessarily agree, but if that has been the past interpretation and it has turned up to be accurate, I suppose induction is a better proof than nothing on Day 1. I think I'll place a vote at the end of the day, even if it doesn't mean my candidate (or any) gets killed, at least it might help to vindicate me in the future. At worst I throw a vote on someone without to much reason and it doesn't actually cause their death. I would be much less willing to vote at this point if it actually meant they would be lynched.

Can we just take a poll? Maybe everyone can make an unofficial vote if they are in favor or against a no lynch on day one in this game (not as a general principle) and explain why? If the town is organized and believes that to be the best way to move forward, maybe we can just get on to the next day with a no vote that is impending anyway since so many of us refuse to vote without more evidence. To answer my own question, in this game I suppose I would bend to the will of the town if they thought it was in the best interest and it would move the day along. I mean, if no one thinks they're actually going to vote for someone seriously anyway, then what is the use in dragging it out? I don't at all mean to be hasty, it just seems unnecessary. The other option, which I would be in favor of, is to lynch an inactive. Did Nerau get replaced? Is he inactive? Am I forgetting any other inactive players?

[FightingOkra]

I'm not sure if we have any inactive players atm. If we do, then I might be up for voting an innactive.

[KevinH]

At this point, an inactive in't really hurting to the point they should be killed off.

They can get more active or they can get replaced -- both beneficial to the town.

[Nerau]

It lives

And I think I saw Nerau reading this thread today..

.

Yes i probably was
I was waiting for it live and probably didnt have second to post

I am against no lynch and i think it will probably most likely happen just b/c of inactivity of this game so far ( its gettng better

Thats is all I have for right will most likely post tommorrow when its not so late

[KevinH]

While it is not scummy per se to vote on day 1, the town will be better off with an extra townie in the future.

[ccabal86]

At this point I'm leaning towards no lynch, just because activity picked up, and there might not be any more totally inactive people left.

[d3mon]

Vote: No Lynch

and lets hope that there is a Cop/Guard

[CanucksDynasty]

There probably is a cop/guard (or something similar) if we face 3 mafia (assume).

[Preston]

Surprise surprise, the day isnt over yet! And only 5 pages for all the time I was gone...? Eh, well it was slow at the start too.

I dont have the time now to go through and read all the posts, but I'll try for that later tonight if I can. I did a quick skim and my overall impressions are:
1) Ouch beebs on the deletion
2) @Tracker: Less RP is sadly probably a good idea though I enjoy a good read sometimes
3) I'm not sure about the FoS on CD; I need to look at that more in depth but it looked like you were doing it because now he's saying no-lynch vs his usual pro-lynch stance. I myself am usually pro day1 lynch, but per my earlier post I dont know how useful it is with a mostly-inactive crowd - point is, changing your stance based on the situation is not itself suspicious. There's no harm in keeping a close eye on CD though; he's a tricky one!
4) Has everyone talked? Is anyone 100% inactive the whole extended day til now? I didnt see a list about that.

-Preston