894 replies to this topic

[Falzis]

Wait mole, Narsis will be replaced?


VOTE COUNT
sojourner (6): Falzis, Narsis, Electric Mango, Kaziocore, Aquinas, Sir Jesus
Falzis (4): Martino, Theophilos, KevinH, sojourner

Not Voting (2): Nerau, partyin01

With 12 alive, 7 votes are needed to lynch.
4 needed to lynch at deadline.

- partyin01 and Nerau are being replaced. I've sent out PMs to 2 replacements, who are yet to reply.
- Narsis will be replaced or be V/LA from June 29th.
- Falzis will be V/LA from July 1st - July 11th
- Deadline is TOMORROW.
- Sojourner, if you need to be away for more than a few days, please PM me in advance so I know and don't have you replaced. Hope everything gets sorted out.
- Aquinas, I'll decide who gets replaced and who doesn't.

Edited by molestargazer, 28 June 2009 - 12:19 PM.
Vote count

[Narsis]

yes unless he decides to put the game in an extended night period. i'll be gone from the 29th to the 12th. i'd rather someone else replace me and have their voice heard etc. then to have no one in my place.

[sojourner]

I am sure this will change what everyone thinks..I am out of town on a family emergency and have not been on except for short times. I know I am town. The reason I have voted for Falzis is that he has gone crazy trying to take the fingers off of himself. The reason that people think I am scum is cause I did not post much,well what about Aquinas who has jumped in my bandwagon quickly after not posting much himself. If sacrificing a townie to get info is what you want then sacrifice me. To me the scum is stil Falzis and so I am sticking with my vote.

[Narsis]

First, not to be inconsiderate but you were posting elsewhere in the forums(such as spam) and were on IRC. you could have easily informed us earlier.

Second, Falzis most definitely has not gone crazy. sure he's active and posting a lot but he is making sense.

Third, we don't think you are scum because you aren't posting, but it doesnt help your case.

[Aquinas]

I am sure this will change what everyone thinks..I am out of town on a family emergency and have not been on except for short times. I know I am town. The reason I have voted for Falzis is that he has gone crazy trying to take the fingers off of himself. The reason that people think I am scum is cause I did not post much,well what about Aquinas who has jumped in my bandwagon quickly after not posting much himself. If sacrificing a townie to get info is what you want then sacrifice me. To me the scum is stil Falzis and so I am sticking with my vote.

If you are unable to dedicate time, please let us know so we can have you replaced. Otherwise you're expected to play, especially if no one has any idea why you are gone. That in mind, I hope things are okay with your family. Good luck with whatever you're all dealing with.

As for your reasons against Falzis, a staunch defense against ones own conviction is not a scum tell. It is a shared trait by town and scum that they should defend themselves.

Your infrequent posting is not a decisive factor in my vote against you, although it does factor in. Someone who barely shows up and then contributes little is not a very strong town player. Townie or not, that's not good. Its not necessarily a scum tell but, it does hurt your credentials to not be able to construct a solid case against someone you figure to be scum.

As for myself. Admittedly, I did jump on the train running against you just after it had left the station. However, I believe I did so with a solid case and developed reasoning. Please, reference the post in which I first voted for you. There you will find all that I felt I needed to post to justify my action. My post count may not be high, but I do try to make them count. My intention is quality over quantity.
not
I do not believe Falzis is scum although, time will tell. I do not feel that he has shown a significant amount of scum tells nor do I feel that a solid argument has built up against him. You can find my thoughts on Falzis throughout the KevinH/Falzis debate. There I outline why I sided with him on the issue and why I believe he is acting in the interests of the town. If you are right Sojourner, forgive me.

My vote remains against Sojourner. I asserted that I would change my vote from Sojourner if he or someone else provided comparable evidence in his defense. That has not been met to my standard so far.

Sojourner, I feel that I have addressed enough in my posts either here or elsewhere referenced to defend all that I have claimed. Your claim of the opposite is ill founded and I assure you, I remain acting in the best interests of the town.

[Aquinas]

If you are unable to dedicate time, please let us know so we can have you replaced. Otherwise you're expected to play, especially if no one has any idea why you are gone. That in mind, I hope things are okay with your family. Good luck with whatever you're all dealing with.

As for your reasons against Falzis, a staunch defense against ones own conviction is not a scum tell. It is a shared trait by town and scum that they should defend themselves.

Your infrequent posting is not a decisive factor in my vote against you, although it does factor in. Someone who barely shows up and then contributes little is not a very strong town player. Townie or not, that's not good. Its not necessarily a scum tell but, it does hurt your credentials to not be able to construct a solid case against someone you figure to be scum.

As for myself. Admittedly, I did jump on the train running against you just after it had left the station. However, I believe I did so with a solid case and developed reasoning. Please, reference the post in which I first voted for you. There you will find all that I felt I needed to post to justify my action. My post count may not be high, but I do try to make them count. My intention is quality over quantity.
not
I do not believe Falzis is scum although, time will tell. I do not feel that he has shown a significant amount of scum tells nor do I feel that a solid argument has built up against him. You can find my thoughts on Falzis throughout the KevinH/Falzis debate. There I outline why I sided with him on the issue and why I believe he is acting in the interests of the town. If you are right Sojourner, forgive me.

My vote remains against Sojourner. I asserted that I would change my vote from Sojourner if he or someone else provided comparable evidence in his defense. That has not been met to my standard so far.

Sojourner, I feel that I have addressed enough in my posts either here or elsewhere referenced to defend all that I have claimed. Your claim of the opposite is ill founded and I assure you, I remain acting in the best interests of the town.

That arbitrary "not" in the middle of my post should be ignored. It was meant to go in the sentence "My post count may not be high, but I do try to make them count." after I realized I had forgotten to put a not in the sentence. Ooops.

[KevinH]

If nothing changes, Sojourner will be lynched tomorrow. I'm OK with that but we can discuss the implications now if he is scum or townie. One of us will get night-killed and we can use all the discussion we can get.

[Narsis]

it's difficult to discuss ahead. who knows what might be said? or who might die?

[molestargazer]

CanucksDynasty replaced partyin01.
Sorry for the long wait - welcome to the game!

[KevinH]

Ladies and Gentlemen,
The ranking #1 mafia player has arrived.
Welcome, CanucksDynasty!

[Falzis]

Is it the 29th already? It's the 30th where I am (2am).

[Narsis]

lol. today is the 29th. i'll actually be leaving this afternoon so i either need to get replaced or i'll be V/LA or whatever.

but yeah anyway...CD! before the day is out...any thoughts?

[sojourner]

Okay here is my take on my innocence and my case against EM and Falzis, and their words in most cases speak for themselves.

Kevin starts right out with the no lynch...why would he do this if he is scum? The Wiki substantiates him:
Allowing the Townspeople to abstain from killing on certain turns can decrease or increase the Mafia win percentage as can variants which make it more difficult for the Mafia to achieve a kill (e.g., requiring them to agree on a victim independently). The "no kill" variant compensates to some extent for the disadvantage given to odd numbers of Townspeople. Otherwise, 2n+1 Innocents are less likely to win than 2n Innocents (for n>2) because they have decreased their odds of voting for a Mafia each turn without increasing their number of turns (resulting in ties rather than Mafia majorities).

EM votes for me after Kazio throws my name in the ring with nothing
EM
Why is everyone jumping on Narsis? I'm guessing one of them is scum.

Vote: sojourner

Reason: Jumping on the Narsis bandwagon

Then Falzis jumps on early on also
FALz
Ok, hmm... lemme see. sojourner seems a bit cuckoo, the world would be a better place with less mentally instable people.

Vote: sojourner








Now that they have the suspicion on me they start to get other people to vote
EM
Sitting around and not voting on day 1 is pointless as many have already said. How else are we to gain information? True the odds of lynching a townie over a scum is higher but it's a chance we must take, if nothing else it will give us information to go off of on day 2.

EM sides with Falzis right out the gate
I'm giving Falzis a vote of confidence for being most townie so far. I gotta say that I like this guys style. He comes out guns blazin right from the word go. Either he's crazy or he's innocent but right now he's getting some good points from me.
My reasoning for the suspicion is that scum would want to wait until a misguided townie starts a lynch and then jump in and try to complete the lynch.
a lynch and then jump in and try to complete the lynch.
Exactly Kevin hits it right on the button


When Aquinas asks what evidence there is against me
Falzis
Defending on sojourner's behalf much? And pushing for KevinH's head much?

Not just he's a bandwagoner but the lack of logical basis for his votes. His recent post proves as much.


After SJ votes Kevin it is EM who tries to change his vote
I've played several games with Kevin and I have always been impressed with his insight to the inner mechanics of the game. He has always appeared to be a sharp minded strategist and has helped his fellow townies win several games. He's not the weakest link and you said that he's not giving off any scum tells. If you agree with opinion that Kevin can be an asset later in the game it is only logical that you change your vote.
I'm not saying that Kevin is giving me any pro town vibes at all. In fact he's one that I'm keeping a watchful eye on because of what I've stated before. This argument was only meant to give insight into my personal views of KevinH and to intellectually challenge SirJesus on his vote.
Kevin sees this clearly
Kevin
I don't vote for no-lynch out of principle. I vote for no-lynch because I believe that the "scumtells" that some people claim are not reliable at all. It's about a 75% chance of killing a townie that we will need later and I don't like those odds.

On the other hand, if I am about to be lynched, that's a 100% chance of lynching a townie and I will do what I can to avoid that. Forcing me to put a vote on the second-place candidate is not gathering any additional information; the vote for me might as well go on the second-place candidate straight off because it's the same effect.
Falzis
We're not getting anywhere except the No Lynch debate still. I do still think sojourner is very suspiciousssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
sssssssss.
Now people are starting to see that Falzis is a little pushy without much substance



Kevin
Is not voting any different than voting no lynch? Not really, unless a majority votes for no lynch then the day can end early.
With Sojourner having the most votes at the moment, there will be a few misguided souls who pile on "because we have to lynch somebody".
There's only a 25% chance that Sojourner is scum. (Misunderstanding the cop role is not a very strong scum-tell in my opinion.)
The scum would love to have one less townie. Will they get their way? Or will we coast into the deadline without a lynch?
Note that at deadline, only a half majority is required to lynch so that would be 4 votes by my count.


Narsi
Just a little clearing up but why so hard on sojourner? he's new to the game and may not fully understand how cop roles work. i think it would warrant an explanation at worst(as you gave) but no reason for an FoS or vote. the same goes to junk and anyone else on the sojourner wagon.

Aquinas
Finally, I looked through a few of Falzis' posts. In many of them he he calling for voting or some other rash action rather than discussion, at least as of late. I wouldn't raise a finger of suspicion or even a nod but, its something I'll keep in mind. I know for a good while he was just looking for people to post with him. His post count is probably high, I don't know exactly what to make of this except that it may be a way to get people riled up and vote. Overall however, I get good feelings from him and I don't suspect i'll be needing to vote for him any time soon. I might just be groveling for scum tells by this point...





Falzis wants the vote since he knows he is scum and so is EM it is in their best interest to keep the finger on me
Falzis
I like how Electric Mango and Aquinas posts their townie vibes. If they're getting a good feeling on me, and telling people about it, and I know I'm a townie, I'm getting good vibes from them too. Scum don't usually do town / scum readings especially on the first day so I'm picking up good signals from them.
And
Vote already people. Show your cards... if you're not insane.

Push for the vote
Narsis
to be honest there is no good case against anyone. at least not one good enough to warrant a vote...yet.
Falzis
Vote for anybody Narsis if as you said it's better to lynch than to not lynch. -.-
EM
I hope the voting picks up. There are still lots of people who say that voting is the best way but have not voted for anyone yet. If we don't vote to lynch someone today then how are we going to pick up on voting patterns later in the game? It will be just like Day 1 started all over again. Did someone say dejevu? Well, I guess it won't be entirely the same, we'll have 1 less townie.






Aquinas picks up on the push to vote and who …me
Aquinas
Falzis, I understand your rational for wanting more voting. You seem to be quite pushy about getting people to make uninformed and uncomfortable choices. This makes me uncomfortable and I'll be strait with you, a bit suspicious. I don't understand why you are so adamant about this. I think rather than taunting and pushing people to vote your time would be better spent bringing forward some evidence for who we should vote for. Clearly, the problem is we don't have someone who we feel needs to be voted for rather than our desire to vote.
Do you notice any patterns or have any evidence against someone? Hopefully besides Sojourner and KevinH since those two both have been discussed to death.

Falzis
Ok here's what I think. Frankly, I think either sojo is really scum because at this point still, no one is jumping on him so it must mean his Mafia friends aren't voting because Mafia would have jumped already on someone (assuming they number around 3 people in this game) to push a lynch. And no one wants to vote as the fourth person for lynching sojo because that would still make the half majority rule.
Falzis
But I'll stick to sojo for the meantime, my gut is telling me to stick with it for now. If he dies, more food to ration for everyone (I actually only care about more food for me)! MUAHAHA
So I think that it was just coincidence that I came up for vote. I am new to the game so I did not know how to defend myself. EM and Falzis both jumped me knowing that and then tried to sway others to vote. Hey also started talking people out of voting for others so they could sway them towards me. They both pushed for the vote knowing they were in the clear with the heat off and fingers on me.
And then my misfortune of losing the internet and this family emergency have caused me to not be watching and posting as good as I could have which has given them the opportunity to use my silence as a reason to vote me.
They were the two who stuck to voting for me all along.
I think that all these facts add up to a scum tell for Falzis and EM.

[molestargazer]

VOTE COUNT
sojourner (6): Falzis, Narsis, Electric Mango, Kaziocore, Aquinas, Sir Jesus
Falzis (4): Martino, Theophilos, KevinH, sojourner

Not Voting (2): Nerau, partyin01

With 12 alive, 7 votes are needed to lynch.
4 needed to lynch at deadline.

- partyin01 has been replaced by CanucksDynasty.
- I have now run out of replacements. If someone who's dead (who isn't scum) wishes to replace in, please shoot me off a PM, it'd be much appreciated.
- Narsis will be replaced or be V/LA from June 29th.
- Falzis will be V/LA from July 1st - July 11th

As day ends, and the shadows on the barred windows begin to creep up the wall, you find that about half of you are all pointing at the same man to be scum. You drag him, kicking and screaming, to a makeshift noose you constructed which is hanging from a ceiling light in the cafeteria.
"NO! NO!" Sojourner lashes out and wildly kicks an unsuspecting Aquinas in the face, who falls back shouting in pain. You decide that enough is enough. Whilst at least 4 people hold him steady, Sir Jesus slams Sojourner's face down onto one of the tables. His head cracks, and he falls still.

Looking into his cell, you see nothing but a small notepad with "Greg's Diary" written on it in childish handwriting, detailing his stay in the hospital, and a hidden stash of Vicodin under the bed. He wasn't scum.

Sojourner, TOWNIE, has been lynched.
It is now NIGHT 2. All night actions in to me by THURSDAY, about this time.

[molestargazer]

Lauren sighed, rubbed her eyes tiredly, and stepped away from the cell of the inmate who she had been looking over through the night. She took two steps away from the cell, and two men stepped out of the shadows.
"What are you doing?" She tried to look at their faces, but saw nothing. They were wearing hoods.
They began to stride towards her. "What-?"

The two men pulled out knives and simultaneously stabbed her in the torso, cutting a hole right through. Her eyes widened, she tried to take a gasp of air, then collapsed. The men walked away.

In the morning, you wake up and find the body - damn!

Narsis, WEAK DOC, has been killed.

It is now DAY 3.
To allow for V/LAs and time for replacements, today will run for 3 weeks rather than 2. The day can, of course, be ended earlier by lynching.
Deadline for Day 3 is THURSDAY, the 23rd JULY.

Notes:
- Falzis will be V/LA until July 11th.
- Narsis is/was V/LA, but that doesn't matter.
- Nerau still needs replacing. Anyone knows someone / anyone dead wants to do it, shoot me off for a PM.

[Kaziocore]

oh god
we will all die!

and sorry sojourner wherever you are

[CanucksDynasty]

At first, I was going on the presumption of 3 scum.
But the night scene mentions "two men pulled out knives".
However, 2 scum seems to low for a game this size.

These are the people left that voted for soj.
Falzis, Electric Mango, Kaziocore, Aquinas, Sir Jesus

Right now...I will focus on them more so than the others (Martino, Theophilos, KevinH).

Falzis - obvious scum choice. He was near the chopping block but managed to persuade others to look in soj direction. His reasoning for soj was weak (the first vote).

EM - has been voting alongside Falzis (the third vote)...not sure what to make of it.

Kasiocore - even less reasoning for voting for soj (his was the 4th vote).

Aquinas - gave a somewhat reason for his vote (the 5th vote).

Sir Jesus - joined the bandwagon (the 6th vote that ensure soj will be lynched...cuz even if I and Nerau voted for Falzis...it would only be 6 votes..a tie...but soj got to 6 first so he gets lynched).


From that... and the assumption that Falzis is indeed scum.
I think Falzis, Kasiocore and Sir Jesus are the scum we are looking for (provided all 3 scum voted for soj).

CD.

[CanucksDynasty]

Ladies and Gentlemen,
The ranking #1 mafia player has arrived.
Welcome, CanucksDynasty!

Thanks but vgm holds that #1 spot.

[Kaziocore]

3 scums in a 12 player game?
Isn't that unfair for the townies?

[CanucksDynasty]

3 scums in a 12 player game?
Isn't that unfair for the townies?

It is fair for the townies.
If it was only 2 scum...then one lucky lynch and it would be almost impossible for scum to win.

But back to the game...
@ Kaziocore - what reasoning did you have for voting for soj (other than you think he was scum)?