1469 replies to this topic

[CanucksDynasty]

I've read through the pages, and I tend to agree with Falzis. While CD has done nothing particularly scummy, my gut is saying that his posts are a bit more aggressive than usual.

Both CD and EM have been dogging KevinH pretty hard, apparently because he is trying to "mislead" the town. I think you guys are jumping to conclusions WAY too fast there, I totally agree with KevinH in that the cop should leave hints. He could drop dead anytime, there is not point in leaving breadcrumbs. Hints left in a subtle enough fashion will be passed over by every player, until the clue-dropper turns out to be the cop. Then every post can be analyzed and evidence can be derived in that fashion.

Also, KevinH's "no lynch" strategy is also not a scumtell. While I personally don't agree with it, the circumstances of our situation could lead (the misguided ) to believe that it would be in the best interests of the town.

I'm not one to stick my neck out for others, but I think EM and CD are railing against KevinH's discussion points far too hard. To me, it seems like they are stifling one side of the conversation while keeping up the impression of a dialogue with KEvinH.

I agree that perhaps the cop should leave hints...but not in the fashion that KevinH had recommended.
As for dogging on KevinH...I do that to everyone whose posts don't seem to match up (ie. SinKon and junkahoolic).

VOTE COUNT
junkahoolik (2): Martino, Firkked
KevinH (1): Electric Mango


Not Voting (9): Narsis, Junkahoolik, KevinH, Sir Jesus, angel of doom, Falzis, Kaziocore, Aquinas, CanucksDynasty

With 12 alive, 7 is needed to lynch.

Edited by molestargazer, 24 November 2009 - 06:03 PM.

[Falzis]

I don't understand this.
Why do you think there is 2 mafia factions?
What led you to believe this?

That was my question to him, and subsequently Kazio (who made me aware that he also raised the idea of an SK). I forgot the term in mafia but whoever raises a role first is usually that role... that's why I'm suspicious of junk and Kazio (although he could be a vigilante since I'm putting Kazio more on the townie side).

[Electric Mango]

Yes I'm dogging on KevinH, that's my job. People need to be pushed for information. We can't sit back and be all nicey nicey to each other and expect the scum to role claim. Too do good scum hunting we have to play hard ball.

My claims against KevinH are valid.

If someone gives me more evidence on someone else I'll consider it but as of right now, KevinH seems less townie than any one else.

[CanucksDynasty]

From pg 1 on sample Townie role pm

You win when all of the Mafia Members are dead, and at least one pro-town member survives.

MOD: Does pro-town member mean a pro-town power role?
Yes. Because, well, pro-town powerroles are still pro-town.

Edited by molestargazer, 24 November 2009 - 06:04 PM.

[Narsis]

From pg 1 on sample Townie role pm


MOD: Does pro-town member mean a pro-town power role?

i would assume it includes anyone with that win condition, which could include power roles...

[CanucksDynasty]

i would assume it includes anyone with that win condition, which could include power roles...

For some reason...I read that as a pro-town power role had to survive.
So in other words...as long as a townie (vanilla or pro-town power role) survives...town wins (as usual).

I got confused when researching junk and kazio post about a possible SK.
And needed clarification on that part from Mole.

[junkahoolik]

i think killing 5 pro town players without adding any kind of stress regarding who are the other mafia players at the cost of 1 scum in a 13 players game can be considered a good deal for the scum if the scum players are a 3man faction. however, if they are just 2, they probably think there is a sk. so it wouldn't be in their interest to nk because of the possibility that the sk would nk too. which would narrow down the hunt waaay too significantly.

[junkahoolik]

this is why i think there is a sk on board.

[CanucksDynasty]

i think killing 5 pro town players without adding any kind of stress regarding who are the other mafia players at the cost of 1 scum in a 13 players game can be considered a good deal for the scum if the scum players are a 3man faction. however, if they are just 2, they probably think there is a sk. so it wouldn't be in their interest to nk because of the possibility that the sk would nk too. which would narrow down the hunt waaay too significantly.

Yes...in the original setup...the worst case scenario was 5 dead townies and 1 dead mafia at the start of D4 (with 2 possible suspects for N3).
That would have left 5 townies left with 2 mafia. If the setup remained...a worse case scenario could have gone down to 3 townies and 1 mafia. Not particular good odds for mafia but not bad either. It would have boiled down to a D6 mis-lynch in order for mafia to win.

A 2 man mafia group would definitely be too small for a game this size. I can see how it can be viewed as 2 possible mafia groups (one group being a sk).


However...that was the worst case scenario. In the best case scenario...townie would have lynched mafia correctly (have 50%) on D2. A 3 man mafia group may have decided to wait it out for a better setup when/if the plane crashes. Fortunately for them...the rules got changed. So they were correct in not nk-ing.


Personally...I don't think there is a sk.
That's my opinion.

[Electric Mango]

We have 3 people who have voted.

Day2 will only last two weeks now per Mole's rule change.

Most people agree that we should lynch today.

I'd like to see some more people voice their opinions/vote and give reasons why.

[Firkked]

I'm disinclined to believe there is an SK on board, even with the N1 town strategy I believe there would have been a NK with the SK

[Electric Mango]

After tonight we'll know if there's an SK or not. As for my guess, I'll say there is.

[KevinH]

Rule 5-1 has been removed but there is no mention of Rule 5 being removed.
Mod: Is it still true that "Players may only carry out night actions on players they in the same area as." (sic)?
Yes.

Yeah...that comment was based on the old setup with the move restrictions.
Since that appears to be gone...the doc can move freely about and protect the cop.

I'm not so certain that move restrictions are gone. There is a new mechanic that we won't be told about. It could be anything.

[Martino]

I'm disinclined to believe there is an SK on board, even with the N1 town strategy I believe there would have been a NK with the SK

While I have no reason to believe there is a SK, we can't exclude the possibility based on the no NK on night 1. A SK must survive until the end of the game. Had he killed N1, he would have gotten himself lynched on D2 or D3.

[Kaziocore]

I think I have a bad feeling about Martino.
I think he looked more active when he was townie the last game. I don't know.

[Falzis]

You know what I've noticed? Sinkon is conspicuously absent or lying low. This is very peculiarly in contrast with his eagerness on D1. He was already a bit jarring on D1 and I'm thinking he might be avoiding getting the ire he got on D1... hmm....

Vote: Sinkon

Until he appears and convinces me otherwise.

[KevinH]

While I have no reason to believe there is a SK, we can't exclude the possibility based on the no NK on night 1. A SK must survive until the end of the game. Had he killed N1, he would have gotten himself lynched on D2 or D3.

I agree. A SK faced the very same situation as the mafia so would not want to kill and expose himself.

[junkahoolik]

we'll have to wait and see if there is a sk or not. best now to drop it and concentrate somewhere else.

[CanucksDynasty]

I agree. A SK faced the very same situation as the mafia so would not want to kill and expose himself.

I agree.

But here's the question...why are we talking about a possible sk?
In most games, a sk is not included.
So why are we so concerned about it?
It's not like we can stop a sk from a nightkill (unless there's a role blocker).

Whether it's 2 groups or 1 group...there should probably be 3 bad guys in a game this size.

[Falzis]

HMM unless some people are dropping hints of the possibility of an SK to mislead town from mafia NKs...