194 replies to this topic

[Imran Ehsan]

Also, probably one of the most honest articles out there on the topic.

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/6462584

Should read it thrice.

 

Great article. Really highlights the hypocrisy.

[TheWanderer]

That's an excellent article.

 

On a personal note, I've been totally disheartened by not only the act itself, but by a lot of the reactions to it (some even in this thread).

[Theophilos]

I'm sorry I had to go bowling so I have not been here to respond. I said I was not an authority on religion, I'm agnostic and I don't care. As I understand excommunication, it's a Catholic thing and many Christians don't give a fig what the Pope has to say about anything.

 

I guess I should have said that it is my opinion that anyone who was, or is, a Governor of a state is qualified to be President. Being a Governor of a state is very similar to President. That is why Governors always are the best Presidents. I'll put it in a way even Democrats can understand... Bill Clinton was a far better President on his worst day than Barack Obama has been on his best. Not saying a Governor cannot be so bad at the job that it would make people run the other direction... but I am saying George W. Bush was well qualified for his two terms and Sarah Palin was well qualified to be John McCain's VP. John McCain didn't win and if he was ever a Governor it would have helped him.

 

Anyone who thinks J.K. Rowlin knows more about the world than Rupert Murdock is stoned. I'm done talking about religion.

 

Two things:

1. the point was simply that excommunication is not singular to Catholicism, therefore it is certainly not "a Catholic thing";

2. Try avoiding insulting people that disagree with you, it tends to help in a debate.

 

Nobody said that JKR knows more then RM about the world, but your implications that he does fall by far short of being convincing or indeed true.

 

With respect to Governors ... I do not per se disagree with you, but you did add Ms Palin, which to my knowledge was only Governor for 3y or so, that didn't do much to prepare her for anything, not even for the Vice-Presidency (let alone the Presidency). I do agree, that McCain would have most likely benefited though, and would have been by far a better President of the US then the current one, and on his worst day at that.

 

You might not know this, but I'm probably more conservative than you are ... I just disagree with your exclusionist logic (i.e. you agree with me or you are against me). That said, if I misunderstood the nature of your posts, I apologize.

[Theophilos]

 

 

 

 

basically speaking about "catholic" is someone following Rome, around here we call them fully "roman catholic". christianity is just the whole package of anything believing Christ.

 

Christianity <=> Islam

Catholic/Protestant <=> Sunni/Shiite (don't quote me on it but I think the pairing is right aswell, but its a different kind of division then in christianity so it isn't really true either )

 

Nope. Catholicism is universal and all encompassing. Also see Fox Fire's reply

 

 

well thats up to the interpretation of what you find to represent those words. To me Christianity is the all encompassing term BUT also the term to signify a more "active" participation in the religion.

 

While when someone states they are "catholic", to me that is more about the morals but less about the tales surrounding them. offcourse this is just cause mine (and your ) side of the woods (western europe) has such a decline in active religious followers that the term itself is adjusted to our own will. Heck most if not all of the "off-shoots" a religion has is cause 2 people couldn't agree on something said by someone standing before them, funny this isn't limited to religion alone .

 

 

Not quite, it is what the word actually means (katholikos = universal). Therefore Catholic Church = Christendom

 

As Fire Fox suggested, as per the Nicene Creed, "Et unam, sanctam, catholicam et apostolicam Ecclesiam".

 

dictionary's don't change at all for you hé?

 

I meant that the meaning of words can get astrange from their origin, why you think etymology is a thing?

 

 

Tsk tsk Betsy, they can't in this case. The word katholikos was "created" for the Church (e.i. etymology works in my favour here)

 

It is its originary meaning, therefore it has nowhere to go from here And the Catholic Church maintains that precisely that is its meaning

[Lysistrata]

Hello Theo. It was not my intention to insult you. It was my intention to shine light on how rediculous the notion is. World leaders fall over themselves every day to get a piece of the world influence of Rupert Murdock. J.K. Rowlin is an author of childrens books, and her greatest challenge of the day is will she have tea before or after her bath. It's scary who pop culture creates, and then grants them all this intelligence that they don't have.

 

I was wrong about all Governors being qualified to be President. Arnold Schwarzenegger was Governor of California. Not qualified to be President because he was not born in the United States. John McCain was also born in Panama, but he got a pass on the restriction because his father was an naval officer stationed in Panama when John was born. My apologies.

[Shahenshah]

Is not being born/not citizen makes you unqualified by law or your opinion?

[Lysistrata]

To be President of the United States you must be a natural born citizen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizenship_requirements_for_President_of_the_United_States

[Lysistrata]

Did this derail your muslim plot to take over? We're onto you dude.

[onbekende]

 

Tsk tsk Betsy, they can't in this case. The word katholikos was "created" for the Church (e.i. etymology works in my favour here)

 

It is its originary meaning, therefore it has nowhere to go from here And the Catholic Church maintains that precisely that is its meaning

 

 

and I just want to note that "meaning" evolves

 

also, germany is an ass, I tried updating our cars satnav and twice it broke on the map for germany

 

all hail queen Merkel o/

[Blade 619]

Is not being born/not citizen makes you unqualified by law or your opinion?

 

For a nation built by immigrants, they really hate immigrants.

[Theophilos]

 

 

Tsk tsk Betsy, they can't in this case. The word katholikos was "created" for the Church (e.i. etymology works in my favour here)

 

It is its originary meaning, therefore it has nowhere to go from here And the Catholic Church maintains that precisely that is its meaning

 

 

and I just want to note that "meaning" evolves

 

also, germany is an ass, I tried updating our cars satnav and twice it broke on the map for germany

 

all hail queen Merkel o/

 

 

I know Germany is an ass >.< (mind only about some things) But why are you complaining, u are just visiting, I live here

[Theophilos]

Hello Theo. It was not my intention to insult you. It was my intention to shine light on how rediculous the notion is. World leaders fall over themselves every day to get a piece of the world influence of Rupert Murdock. J.K. Rowlin is an author of childrens books, and her greatest challenge of the day is will she have tea before or after her bath. It's scary who pop culture creates, and then grants them all this intelligence that they don't have.

 

I was wrong about all Governors being qualified to be President. Arnold Schwarzenegger was Governor of California. Not qualified to be President because he was not born in the United States. John McCain was also born in Panama, but he got a pass on the restriction because his father was an naval officer stationed in Panama when John was born. My apologies.

 

Hey hey,

 

Well to be sure, the same could be said for Murdock, i.e. he is not coveted for his intelligence (nobody is denying he has that, he did build a Media empire after all), but rather the leverage of his Company. JKR is coveted (although to a far lesser extent) for the same, her media influence. Whether either of the two has any intelligence is of no importance to those who seek their media leverage. That was my point.

 

Not really, but you have bad examples of Governors just as in every other field/occupation. Clearly running a federal state may (I say may, because it is not necessarily true in every case, bad apples and all that) improve and indeed contribute to one being better prepared for the Presidency.

[Third King]

 

Is not being born/not citizen makes you unqualified by law or your opinion?

 

For a nation built by immigrants, they really hate immigrants.

 

 

In my opinion, being foreign born does not make someone unfit to become president. But I certianly understand why we don't conduct an international search for the position

 

Also, Catholicism does not encompass all of Christianity. Then again I may have missed some sarcasm in my hasty reading

[Fox Fire]

 

 

Is not being born/not citizen makes you unqualified by law or your opinion?

 

For a nation built by immigrants, they really hate immigrants.

 

 

In my opinion, being foreign born does not make someone unfit to become president. But I certianly understand why we don't conduct an international search for the position

 

Also, Catholicism does not encompass all of Christianity. Then again I may have missed some sarcasm in my hasty reading

 

I think the whole idea behind that is to ensure the president is well educated about all aspects of America. Hence why you must also have lived in the states for the last some odd years to be qualified as well.

 

And Catholicism doesn't encompass all of Christianity. It's not even the oldest, but it's a sect of Christianity.

[Shahenshah]

I offcourse understand you have to be citizen of the country to run for the post. I was wondering if the law? insists you have to be born here, if that is the case, it is absolutely fine. I was wondering what the law said at the time, was to lazy for google

[Lysistrata]

 

I think the whole idea behind that is to ensure the president is well educated about all aspects of America. Hence why you must also have lived in the states for the last some odd years to be qualified as well.

This requirement was intended to protect the nation from foreign influence. Unfortunately there is not much to protect the nation from itself. We are a nation of laws, and with those laws, lines have to be drawn somewhere. There have always been snarky remarks about hating immigrants, but they still keep coming. I think we can have one job in this country that you must be born here to hold. Most of us at least feel a little safer when we have a Constitution, and not just a ruling class.

[Theophilos]

 

 

Is not being born/not citizen makes you unqualified by law or your opinion?

 

For a nation built by immigrants, they really hate immigrants.

 

 

In my opinion, being foreign born does not make someone unfit to become president. But I certianly understand why we don't conduct an international search for the position

 

Also, Catholicism does not encompass all of Christianity. Then again I may have missed some sarcasm in my hasty reading

 

 

That depends on who you ask Jokes aside ... the point is more that the Catholic Church claims universality, i.e. that it is all encompassing.

 

 

 

 

Is not being born/not citizen makes you unqualified by law or your opinion?

 

For a nation built by immigrants, they really hate immigrants.

 

 

In my opinion, being foreign born does not make someone unfit to become president. But I certianly understand why we don't conduct an international search for the position

 

Also, Catholicism does not encompass all of Christianity. Then again I may have missed some sarcasm in my hasty reading

 

I think the whole idea behind that is to ensure the president is well educated about all aspects of America. Hence why you must also have lived in the states for the last some odd years to be qualified as well.

 

And Catholicism doesn't encompass all of Christianity. It's not even the oldest, but it's a sect of Christianity.

 

 

No, all the other Christian denominations are sects of the Catholic Church.

 

 

 

I think the whole idea behind that is to ensure the president is well educated about all aspects of America. Hence why you must also have lived in the states for the last some odd years to be qualified as well.

This requirement was intended to protect the nation from foreign influence. Unfortunately there is not much to protect the nation from itself. We are a nation of laws, and with those laws, lines have to be drawn somewhere. There have always been snarky remarks about hating immigrants, but they still keep coming. I think we can have one job in this country that you must be born here to hold. Most of us at least feel a little safer when we have a Constitution, and not just a ruling class.

 

 

Another thing to consider with respect to the US requirement (although the US is not the only Country with such requirements) is the circumstances of the time. With all the "foreign" powers fighting in the North America it made a lot of sense.

[Khandov]

 

I think the whole idea behind that is to ensure the president is well educated about all aspects of America. Hence why you must also have lived in the states for the last some odd years to be qualified as well.

 

And Catholicism doesn't encompass all of Christianity. It's not even the oldest, but it's a sect of Christianity.

 

 

No, all the other Christian denominations are sects of the Catholic Church.

Indeed. To elaborate, for me, the begin of the Catholic Church is when Jesus told Peter to watch over his herd. If you do not see it that way, then sure you might disagree, but still it was Peter and friends who were the first apostoles. Meaning the catholic church was the first Christian church.

[Fox Fire]

No, all the other Christian denominations are sects of the Catholic Church.

Not Orthodox.

 

 

 

 

I think the whole idea behind that is to ensure the president is well educated about all aspects of America. Hence why you must also have lived in the states for the last some odd years to be qualified as well.

 

And Catholicism doesn't encompass all of Christianity. It's not even the oldest, but it's a sect of Christianity.

 

 

No, all the other Christian denominations are sects of the Catholic Church.

Indeed. To elaborate, for me, the begin of the Catholic Church is when Jesus told Peter to watch over his herd. If you do not see it that way, then sure you might disagree, but still it was Peter and friends who were the first apostoles. Meaning the catholic church was the first Christian church.

 

Let's not forget the Orthodox church here guys.... Oriental Orthodoxy pre-dates the Catholic Church.

There were also Christian churches before that.

[Ghux]

in this world, the loudest mouths are always the dumbest ones.

this thread certainly demonstrates that.