959 replies to this topic

[brewersalliance]

I swear there were more votes on ferastical.

Can we get an official count @velocity

[Ferastical]

@Ferastical - I think you were in the middle of the Rafay wagon (3rd vote maybe?). Can you refresh me on what pushed you to vote for Rafay?

 

He was active D1 so I was like what the hell, let's give the poor man a chance (since you now he's been lynched many times for inactivity now), he then dissed LWW on D1, which was kinda annoying, but I didn't really care that much, cause do what you want on D1, right? Then after the mod kill he went inactive again, and at that point I had a two people, who I slightly trusted vote him, mainly Kevin (who has very good town vibes, can't deny that).

 

The problem I have with the MK vote tho, since he was mod killed when in reality we had like 3+ days left to discuss, I very much believe the wagon would've seen some additions from me, Torres, captainjf or TW, like he mentioned above. I was genuinely confused about what MK was saying about being mafia, then not being mafia, then claiming to have changed alignments, all that stuff. I can say with confidence that around the time when the mod kill took place, I wasn't planning to vote on him, but by the content of his future posts, who knows, I might have, so could have TW, or anyone.

 

 

 

Just to add on my opinion... Ferastical, in my opinion, did not give a confident RC. Just "I'm with the town!!!" kind of like he was only trying to convince others... I am no longer confident in his mild claim.

 

Don't mind your vote, just saying that wasn't my RC...

 

 

 

Ben Winters, ONI Operative - Vanilla Townie, no night actions, my vote is my weapon. Our Role PMs matched word to word by the way. I have no knowledge of my status in the Halo lore unfortunately.

 

And again I ask, what did you expect me to say then? Have it written in big, bulky letters "SCUM HERE" with a red arrow pointing to my name? Claiming I am town is my right as the lawful citizen of this mafia game!!!     You can dismantle my RC all you want, but don't go down on me just because I said I was town, that's just... depressing, honestly.

 

 

Also if I have any say of this, I'd like to go by being burned at the stake rather than hanged, thanks. Would be nice to finally feel some warmth before I go, geez.   

[Ali bin Turban]

I agree that captain and Ferastical are probably our most likely scum at this point, and I'm with brewers that idk how you can make a strong case either way. I would add Robert into the mix since we have nothing confirming his alignment and he's been more absent this game, but I have a vested interest in trying to keep him alive a bit longer until I can help find some more evidence (hence why I might not be able to gather any useful information the next night if I decide to protect Robert instead of trying to snuff out the mafia), so I don't want to put him on the chopping block today. 

Protecting Robert is a waste of night. Noone will target him. If mafia wants to take out jailer they'll hit you, not him.
The best solution is to target supposed scum and prevent a kill this way.

[Robert2424]

Yeah. No offense. Even if they do get me, it's a moot point. They'll go after wp or you first. Me dying may take your ability away but you can avenge me by killing scum. If they really want to NK me. Let them.

Do it scum. Kill me! I'm here! Kill me!

[Robert2424]

So long as we pick one of the 4, I'd be happy with it.

As regards to me potentially being scum. I'm town. But I cannot say for LWW. The says for all Jailkeepers, meaning regardless of role. So if scum has a jailkeeping ability, I enable them as well. I wasn't given the names of Jailkeepers while he was given mine.

The last thing I can say that people glossed over was I named claimed as well. That characters been in the story.

Also theory. I'd LWW did block the person he enabled would it truly go through. I give him the means. Part of me says yes, the other no.

If I was forced to choose from any of the 4 I'd choose captain last only cause he's so new. But if he's closest before deadline, I will vote for him or whoever is closest. If min majority is reached before 24 hours, I might as well join.

[brewersalliance]

i do think the best course of action is to vote for one of the few players that did not vote for either scum.

 

WP claimed cop and its somewhat verifiable, tho he could be scum since he would know who the town are and the choosing abt who is basically confirmed by me could be just a convenient cover. him voting for me over mk when he investigated abt and knew abt was town, therefor mk was scum bothers me a little bit, but he also didnt think the ability i had was a real thing, so thats understandable.  I trust WPs claim as cop

 

TW says he can partially confirm LWW.  I think this means he was probably blocked by LWW.  now it is kinda convienet, as lww announced he blocked tw before TW said anything so it could just be an easy lie.  However, i know TW, and i know he has a shit ton going on in RL.  If he was scum he would have asked for a replacement by now.  no way would he use whats going on right now in his life as cover or something.  hes just not that kind of player.  and truthfully, that is the main reason i think he is town.  its the exact same reason i said he was town in the other game.  thats just not who he is.  he is a fair player and would not game the system like that.  

 

Robert verifies the jailer.  tho im actually kind of shocked he did not vote rafay.  robert is usually one of the first people to join team lynch rafay early and often every single game.  i cant really think of a time where he wasnt on a lynch rafay wagon.  does seem a bit odd.  and as lww pointed out a mod trick can be switching the alignment of an enabler.  kind of like what MK did with me and my lover a few games back.  however, i also feel that how robert claimed wouldnt fit with him being scum.  i dont see it being in scum's advantage to let the entire town know there is a jailer so we can strategize how to best block people. tho at the same time, i guess now that im typing it, we actually have been telegraphing the night actions and who should be jailed or investigated etc,  and it can allow scum to plan around them. so perhapse it was roberts plan all along to bait us into doing this.  LWW would not have been outed as the jailer if robert didnt post what he did, and we would not be activley saying who we should jail and investigate... and now robert is actively asking scum to kill him.  feels a bit off/odd to me.   

 

captian did not vote for either of the scum.  he hasnt really provided us with much the entire game, he has kinda just cruised by.  he is posting a decent amount but nothing controversial, and isnt putting himself out there much.  i said earlier i think scum will try to skate on by unseen/un detected.  he is a very new player and i think this could be what he is trying to do.  or he could just be a new player and he doesnt want to put himself out there by trying to push anyone.

 

i think ive narrowed it down in my mind between captian and robert.  at first i thought ferastical could be a good option, and he still might be with the role pm linking to torres thingy, but i think he would be option three in my mind behind captain and robert.  im gonna keep my vote on captain for now, but i am debating on switching to robert.  its jsut too convenient that his claim led to lww being outed as the jailor and now we are basically telegraphing all our actions for the night. if scum is NOT one of the targets/suspects we are thinking of, then us telegraphing the actions is gonna screw us big time, and i dont think we would be doing this if robert didnt claim the way he did

[lilweirdward]

Yeah I agree, it would actually be a really smart play to claim enabler of an important town PR since it actively discourages town from lynching them as long as they want that PR to be useful. He was one of several people who had a few votes before RCing, so between getting to bide some more time and maybe even predict town's actions and roles, scum would gain a lot by making the play he did.

Unfortunately I don't plan to vote for him today, since I become the most useful if we can feel relatively certain that only one mafia is left. At that point my role sort of turns into another cop, since we can basically clear anyone who is RBed on a night that a kill happens (it's not perfect but it's pretty useful). Lynching him today basically invalidates me and puts a huge target on WP's back since there's likely no one who could protect him. At least with Robert alive, we should get something useful by tomorrow, even if it's just clearing more townies.

Oh also the reason I've suggested protecting Robert is that I don't know if I would even get a result if he gets killed. Also if we somehow lynch another mafia today, it would mostly clear him for us, assuming the last mafia isn't a strongman or something. Also ideally it would be nice to make my and WP's actions ambiguous enough so scum can't plan around them, whoever they are.

[brewersalliance]

i mean that is assuming he is actually telling the truth that he is an enabler too.  that could be a lie just to keep himself alive.  maybe he is a scum role cop and he found u as a jailer and made up the claim to stay alive and to out u at the same time to try to get us to telegraph our actions to the scum (which is kinda what is happening).  not saying that is whats going on, its just a possibility.  i just dont see how his comments revealing you are more beneficial from a towns perspective than scum.  

[lilweirdward]

My role does confirm both that I have Robert as my enabler and that he doesn't know I am the jailkeeper that he enables. I can 100% confirm that part of his claim, not trying to make it seem like that is in doubt. I agree though that it doesn't really benefit town to either reveal himself as an enabler or reveal that a jailkeeper even exists. Frankly it would've made more sense to hold onto that information until a claim came in so he could confirm it.

Idk, Robert always has reasons for his actions so I'm curious why he thinks it was a good idea to reveal all of his information today.

[brewersalliance]

Ahh okay that makes sense then. So Robert is confirmed as an enabler. If he's town he basically just said hey scum u can kill me and the jailer looses his powers. If anything it makes you weaker. I just don't understand how his claim benifits town at all. As scum I think it makes some sense to claim like this but as town it makes no sense to me at all. Plus I don't get why he would literally post for scum to kill him. It feels like to me it's trying to come across as PGO scum bait. Which again makes no sense. If scum wants to get rid of the jailer, which they now know who it is, they will just kill the jailer. I don't get this at all

[Ali bin Turban]

So heres the thing. We can say 2 things about this short list. Remaining scum is within this wagon. I think its prudent I reveal the little information I have as well. It shouldn't really hurt the town by saying it now anyways. Within the list, unless somebody who's claimed VT lied, There is a Town Jailkeeper. I have been told there is at least 1 Jailkeeper in this game at the beginning of the game. Claiming this now I don't believe hurts the town unless I missed something. Meaning, said Jailkeeper RC's and has blocked any remaining on the list, we can shorten the list again. 

 

 

Previously you've specifically said here that there's "Town Jailkeeper", but now you're saing he don't have to be Town?: 

 

 

 

As regards to me potentially being scum. I'm town. But I cannot say for LWW. The says for all Jailkeepers, meaning regardless of role. So if scum has a jailkeeping ability, I enable them as well. I wasn't given the names of Jailkeepers while he was given mine.

 

 

Also what's up with the names? LWW were you given Robert's name? Ok, so LWW has confirmed part with the name. 

 

I'm still curious about that "Town jailkeeper" thing

[brewersalliance]

thats a really good catch, he is directly contradicting himself. saying there is a town jailkeeper but then saying he might not be town

[Robert2424]

It was something I believed there be a town Jailkeeper as there was no N1 kill. As I don't think there be a doc or a regular blocker with a Jailkeeper, I have to assume the Jailkeeper is town. The wording in the Role PM doesn't specify that it is or isn't town. or that there is only 1 person with the Jailkeeping ability. So based upon what has happened at night, and LWW actions fit perfectly. So I can't really doubt he not town. The only way LWW could be lying is if the 2 shot person had it and blocked the kill. In witch case, makes less sense, cause I'd be enabling 1 Jailkeeping ability for 1 night for the town. That don't make much sense to me. So to me, I have to believe LWW as the other options are Far Fetched. 

 

The point of me RCing when I did, was trying to eliminate suspects and get us the best chance in my eyes to win. So while there doubt on me weather I'm town or not, I rather be killed where LWW is basically confirmed town and lives. More Confirmed Townies, the better chance we have. Sure, LWW would be weakened if I died, but I rather die and LWW live as he's basically a confirmed townie. Nobody going to try to vote out a confirmed townie and with a shorter suspect list, we can nail scum and win this. 

[Ali bin Turban]

When you take all this into consideration, then that initial LWW's idea to jail Robert seems quite reasonable. 

 

If you believe TW is a Town, then IMO the good way to proceed now would be to: 

 

- lynch captainjf

- investigate Ferastical with Cop

- Jail Robert

[Robert2424]

I'm not sure about the vote count for sure, but indecision can screw us. I'm going to vote now as not lynching going to hurt us more in the long run here. 

 

Captain is 1 away from hammer lynch, correct? Its hard to tell as there been no vote count update.

[Robert2424]

Torres is also unconfirmed still, so not sure why your not considering him. 

[brewersalliance]

I think captian is at 3 votes. Hammer would be 6 I think with 10 alive. So he's at the half majority. Could be wrong tho as no official vote count has been posted

[Torres951]

Unofficial Vote Count

 

lilweirdward (0):
brewersalliance (0):
ABT (0):
KevinH (0):
The Warrior (2): Ferastical, KevinH
captainjf (3): Torres951, Ali bin Turban, Brewersalliance
Torres951 (1): Robert2424
Ferastical (1): Wolfpacks
Robert2424 (0): 
Wolfpacks (0): 

 

No Lynch (0): 

Not Voting (5): lilweirdward, The Warrior
 

With 10 alive it takes 5 to lynch or 3 at deadline.

Deadline is 10-21 at 6pm CN time.

 

 

Post Count          Total - Day 4

 

brewersalliance  133 - 30

lilweirdward  91 - 21

KevinH  57 - 13

captainjf  49 - 16

Robert2424  48 - 15

Ali bin Turban  39 - 15

The Warrior  39 - 5

Ferastical  38 - 16

Wolfpacks  38 - 6

Torres951  33 - 14

[brewersalliance]

When you take all this into consideration, then that initial LWW's idea to jail Robert seems quite reasonable. 

 

If you believe TW is a Town, then IMO the good way to proceed now would be to: 

 

- lynch captainjf

- investigate Ferastical with Cop

- Jail Robert

 

Here is the problem for telegraphing this tho.  it lets scum know exactly who to avoid killing, and they know they would have a free shot on someone.  lets say there are two scum and robert is one of them.  now he knows not to do the kill since lww will be jailing him and we gain nothing.  roberts role claim and this whole exchange is leading us to give scum a blueprint for how to get their actions done successfully.  its a 16 player game so odds are there are two scum left.  

 

the only way this really works is if captain (or whoemever we lynch) is scum.   if we have two scum left after this we cannot tell them who is being jailed.  it would either allow them to avoid that person as the kill if the target is town, or if the target is scum then that person knows they cannot be the one to make the kill

now if captain flps scum i think its a different story, as there is only one scum left so lww does get a lot more powerful and we can start eliminating the people he jails 

[lilweirdward]

The point of me RCing when I did, was trying to eliminate suspects and get us the best chance in my eyes to win. So while there doubt on me weather I'm town or not, I rather be killed where LWW is basically confirmed town and lives. More Confirmed Townies, the better chance we have. Sure, LWW would be weakened if I died, but I rather die and LWW live as he's basically a confirmed townie. Nobody going to try to vote out a confirmed townie and with a shorter suspect list, we can nail scum and win this.

The problem is the mafia will try to kill me outright instead of you since it doesn't do them any good to have a basically confirmed townie in the game, but there's been enough suspicion raised about you that it's in their best interests to keep you alive, assuming you are town. It's also good cover for you if you're mafia, since you don't have to claim any more powers and it'll be tough once I'm dead to build a strong case against you. Basically I think I get what you were trying to do, but you did it too early - we still have 10 players and at most probably only two scum - to benefit town, or you did it at the perfect time if you were trying to sabotage our efforts with Ferastical having just outed the cop too.

Also brewers just said exactly what I was going to about telegraphing our actions. We should refocus on trying to get scum today, because it changes the calculus a lot to only have one mafia left vs probably having two more. We can lynch captain, but if he's not scum then tomorrow night is gonna get real tricky.