I'll get into more of what I'm thinking later tonight after my life settles down. Today I'm having the Monday at work that I didn't have yesterday. :grenadekx1:

 

VOTE COUNT

Kaziocore (1): AKCPLUTO

 

Not Voting (5): ccabal86, Kaziocore, CanucksDynasty, Preston, Tactical Evil Dan

 

With 6 Alive, 4 is needed to lynch.

Edited March 9, 201115 yr by molestargazer

That would be because I am a plane Jane townie. I have no role to claim beyond that, "negative" (if that's the term to use for EM's insomnia) or otherwise.

I used the term 'negative' to denote a role that in some way interferes with the town's win goals. EM's role interfered by showing up as a false positive on CD's movement list, without any sortof positive benefit to doing so (investigation, protection, etc). My own role is also negative in that it interferes with the town - though not in as overt a way as EM's does/did - and it similarly has no positive upside (I asked mole about this when I got the role and he confirmed that I was unlucky this time around).

 

As to Kaziocore - He did place the 2nd vote on kasabian, but as CD frequently remarked of myself and EM it could be a distancing vote.

 

-Preston

"AKCPLUTO has been fairly inactive after his initial bandwagon on EM on day 3. Has he been observed checking into the thread but not posting"

 

I blame my internet troubles. I have had difficult connecting from my basement suite on a consistent basis until recently. I also blame my recent health troubles insofar as I endured some rough stuff last week.

 

Roleclaim? I am a Plane Jane Vanilla townie.

"AKCPLUTO has been fairly inactive after his initial bandwagon on EM on day 3. Has he been observed checking into the thread but not posting"

 

I blame my internet troubles. I have had difficult connecting from my basement suite on a consistent basis until recently. I also blame my recent health troubles insofar as I endured some rough stuff last week.

 

Roleclaim? I am a Plane Jane Vanilla townie.

 

So both you and TED are just plain townies? I find that hard to believe.

\Tactical Evil Dan - cuz his vote on Kasabian wasn't required and his vote for EM was the hammer (even though he stated he didn't think he was mafia).

 

 

 

Kaziocore - I believe he is townie cuz he placed the 2nd vote on Kasabian.

 

I think the timing of votes isn't a great indicator of allegiance. Any game played in a format such as this is asynchronous. I don't think it's fair to play up the timing of votes when that is the case.

 

I originally backed off on EM when ccabal's status was much less clear (and much more suspect), whereas you were gung ho on EM pretty much the whole time. When it looked far more likely that ccabal was a townie, I was left just as short of definite suspects, and voted him for clearly stated reasons. I was not the only one who selected him for some or all of those reasons, so don't pin EM's death on me just because I was the final vote.

 

I've got a couple of questions that have been rattling around in my mind.

 

If I'm a suspect because I was the last to vote on EM, why isn't Preston a suspect for voting for him and then trying to back off after a lynch had been achieved? I don't know if that strikes you as suspicious, but it certainly strikes me as suspicious. I also don't recall Preston's status ever being questioned -- or at least not as severely as mine has been questioned. Why has he gotten a free pass? Why has his every move not received the scrutiny mine has?

 

Preston has done a very good job in the role of moderator of the discussion, just as CD has -- but CD provided valuable intelligence early on that led to our first scum lynching. Preston has done the same thing I've done -- talk a lot. Where's his limelight?

 

For that matter, with all due respect to CD and Preston, if I was scum just how stupid would I have to be to let you two live? CD especially and even Preston to a lesser extent have been pointing the finger at me and pressuring me since pretty early on in the game. I've spent most of my time debating turns of phrase and the subtleties of paranoia with the two of you. A scum receiving that much attention could've finished the two of you off during the first two nights and spent the rest of the time fencing with a group of townies that would've been largely leaderless in the wake of your deaths.

 

It's obvious to me that whoever the scum are, they're giggling their ass off at us. CD and Preston keep talking about how I'm suspect and asking me pointed questions, all the while killing with impunity and leaving my greatest detractors alone to pick at me.

 

I mean, seriously CD. I'm sure looking at the specific sequence of votes has served you well in the past, but you're ignoring the elephant in the room in favor of me and I can't even see why you're doing it.

"AKCPLUTO has been fairly inactive after his initial bandwagon on EM on day 3. Has he been observed checking into the thread but not posting"

 

I blame my internet troubles. I have had difficult connecting from my basement suite on a consistent basis until recently. I also blame my recent health troubles insofar as I endured some rough stuff last week.

 

Roleclaim? I am a Plane Jane Vanilla townie.

Fortunately you were able to return just as the new day happened, and get in one of the first posts of the day. You similarly had a post on the first day of day 3, then nothing the rest of the time. Quite nice timing for your uncontrollable internet troubles. Though I do hope your health improves.

 

So now we have two roleclaiming plane jane, in a game where we have yet to see a plane jane lynch or night kill - excepting a standard mafia goon. Notable.

 

Let's work on a table of everyone's roles, and when/why they claimed them... eh, I'll do it myself. Feel free to quote/add to this list, especially when Kaziocore claims.

 

Name - Role - When/Why Claimed:

ccabal86 - Curious Child - Claimed on Day 3 to try and finish EM

Kaziocore - Not claimed yet

CanucksDynasty - One-Shot Security Guard - Claimed on Day 2 to start EM/Kasabian lynch effort

Preston - Unspecified Negative Town Role (Details withheld to prevent mafia exploitation) - Claimed on Day 3 during EM discussion to declare negative roles exist

AKCPLUTO - "Plain Jane" - Claimed on Day 4 in response to roleclaim request

Tactical Evil Dan - "Plain Jane" - Claimed on Day 3 during EM discussion when asked if any vanilla townies exist to confirm/deny idea of game where everyone has a role

 

Past Roles for comparison:

Nerau - Whistle-Blowing Lifeguard (One-Use Roleblocker), killed Night One.

Kasabian -Mafia Goon, lynched Day Two.

Chaoshawk - Pool Cleaner (One-Use Vigilante), Killed Night Two.

Electric Mango - Insomniac, lynched Day Three.

KevinH - Friendly Neighbor, Killed Night Three

 

So from this list, we have seen four confirmed town powers: Nerau, Chaoshawk, EM, KevinH.

CD's movement-detecting power is essentially confirmed at this point, unless he's somehow a mafia security guard.

I have a town role - not a USEFUL one, but it's still not vanilla townie.

ccabal has claimed "Curious Child" and been mod-confirmed to at least HAVE a role, though mole made a point of not confirming whether it is town or scum. Ccabal also thought he was "Player X" for some reason, and that CD would back him as town.

 

That's a total of seven people out of the initial eleven in the game that have roles of some sort.

 

I could perhaps see a single vanilla townie - but when mole is going to THAT much trouble to give everyone creative roles, I really have to wonder about those who claim plain jane; is it a bandwagon for scum to jump on, hoping to hide for one more day?

 

I will also note the following:

CD saw EM, Kasabian, KevinH and retroactively ccabal move on night 1. Kasabian was the scum nightkiller, KevinH and EM are confirmed town. If scum had ANY other active (triggered by night PM) roles, they either didn't use them on night 1, dont show up on a movement list., or were ccabal's unknown role. The alternatives are that scum abilities are all passive, or they simply dont have abilities.

 

Today will be interesting as we try to identify one mafia and stay in the game. I am currently still looking hard at AKCPLUTO - he roleclaimed vanilla townie repeating the "plain jane" phrase used by TED. Is this a bandwagon to hide with the presumably roleless? I also cant shake the feeling his selective internet access is very convenient; posting only at the start of two days in a row - would that be the pattern of one who mostly discusses the game in shared PMs with fellow mafia and doesnt post in the game thread to avoid attracting attention or taking a position?

 

I look forward to hearing everyone's views.

 

-Preston

Your post wasnt up when I posted TED, so I'll respond here:

 

I think the timing of votes isn't a great indicator of allegiance. Any game played in a format such as this is asynchronous. I don't think it's fair to play up the timing of votes when that is the case.

 

I originally backed off on EM when ccabal's status was much less clear (and much more suspect), whereas you were gung ho on EM pretty much the whole time. When it looked far more likely that ccabal was a townie, I was left just as short of definite suspects, and voted him for clearly stated reasons. I was not the only one who selected him for some or all of those reasons, so don't pin EM's death on me just because I was the final vote.

Vote records are sometimes all the town has. Mafia tends (I believe) to bandwagon - jumping on votes that are generally accepted opinion so they don't stand out and give people a reason to question them specifically. Those who spearhead efforts get greater exposure - more townie cred if a scum lynch results, more FoS if it's a townie who dies.

 

If I'm a suspect because I was the last to vote on EM, why isn't Preston a suspect for voting for him and then trying to back off after a lynch had been achieved? I don't know if that strikes you as suspicious, but it certainly strikes me as suspicious. I also don't recall Preston's status ever being questioned -- or at least not as severely as mine has been questioned. Why has he gotten a free pass? Why has his every move not received the scrutiny mine has?

 

Preston has done a very good job in the role of moderator of the discussion, just as CD has -- but CD provided valuable intelligence early on that led to our first scum lynching. Preston has done the same thing I've done -- talk a lot. Where's his limelight?

I received a heavy FoS and a LOT of attention from CD on day 2 when I questioned his analysis, being the only townie to do so. I also received skepticism when I roleclaimed a negative town role to support EM. I daresay CD still suspects me somewhat. As for backing out of the lynch, I stated my reasons clearly - I was uncomfortable with the vote I had cast, and wanted to take more time in the day for discussion. I voted EM originally for reasons I stated - he was the only real suspect at the time. I could easily have let the vote ride and joined you in saying "we didnt know" when EM turned up townie - instead I backed down and didnt stick with the bandwagon.

 

For that matter, with all due respect to CD and Preston, if I was scum just how stupid would I have to be to let you two live? CD especially and even Preston to a lesser extent have been pointing the finger at me and pressuring me since pretty early on in the game. I've spent most of my time debating turns of phrase and the subtleties of paranoia with the two of you. A scum receiving that much attention could've finished the two of you off during the first two nights and spent the rest of the time fencing with a group of townies that would've been largely leaderless in the wake of your deaths.

 

It's obvious to me that whoever the scum are, they're giggling their ass off at us. CD and Preston keep talking about how I'm suspect and asking me pointed questions, all the while killing with impunity and leaving my greatest detractors alone to pick at me.

 

I mean, seriously CD. I'm sure looking at the specific sequence of votes has served you well in the past, but you're ignoring the elephant in the room in favor of me and I can't even see why you're doing it.

It's not uncommon for the town to have a doctor or other protective role. Those roles typically protect discussion moderators/leaders on any given night, and if scum targets that person their night kill is wasted and they fall behind. By my understanding, it's not uncommon for mafia to not go after the BIGGEST targets until they're sure the doctor is safely out of the way. And if leaders continue to lead discussion towards lynching non-scum - after Kasabian's death it was clear CD would be going hardcore after EM, so why kill CD when he'd argue to kill a townie?

 

That said, I did expect to be killed myself - I'd been quite a rabble rouser - but KevinH is a more experienced mafia player than I so I guess he ranked higher for that reason. It's also possible mafia believed my negative role claim, and decided to find another target in case I was telling the truth.

 

I already FoS'd you TED, and your attack on me - though I can see some of your logic - doesnt do much to improve your standing in my eyes.

 

-Preston

Oh, and because I didn't include this in my previous post:

TED, when someone is night killed people look at who that person suspected - those people are then suspected more. That's the reason KevinH voted for Kaziocore in case he died, based on the fact that he had used his ability to PM Kaziocore earlier.

 

With that said, we now must also consider Kaziocore - though not so much for just KevinH's death, since KevinH outed himself.

 

-Preston

My health is much improved - thank you.

 

Preston, I agree with you. Hence my vote.

I could perhaps see a single vanilla townie - but when mole is going to THAT much trouble to give everyone creative roles, I really have to wonder about those who claim plain jane; is it a bandwagon for scum to jump on, hoping to hide for one more day?

 

In all fairness, second-guessing mole's construction of the game is part of what led to EM's lynching.

I received a heavy FoS and a LOT of attention from CD on day 2 when I questioned his analysis, being the only townie to do so. I also received skepticism when I roleclaimed a negative town role to support EM. I daresay CD still suspects me somewhat.

 

As for backing out of the lynch, I stated my reasons clearly - I was uncomfortable with the vote I had cast, and wanted to take more time in the day for discussion.

 

I'm pointing it out because I've been grilled a lot more for a lot less.

 

It's not uncommon for the town to have a doctor or other protective role. Those roles typically protect discussion moderators/leaders on any given night, and if scum targets that person their night kill is wasted and they fall behind. By my understanding, it's not uncommon for mafia to not go after the BIGGEST targets until they're sure the doctor is safely out of the way.

 

Which would be a strong argument -- were it not for CD's thoery that the scum have some kind of an investigator or detective that has provided them with valuable intelligence. Nights 1 and 2 saw the deaths of two very powerful roles in what it turns out is a town with a number of oddball roles.

 

That said, I did expect to be killed myself - I'd been quite a rabble rouser - but KevinH is a more experienced mafia player than I so I guess he ranked higher for that reason. It's also possible mafia believed my negative role claim, and decided to find another target in case I was telling the truth.

 

He also wasn't pointing the finger at me, while the two people who have expressed a great deal of suspicion of me are still standing.

 

I already FoS'd you TED, and your attack on me - though I can see some of your logic - doesnt do much to improve your standing in my eyes.

 

Perfectly reasonable, but you started it.

Heading to bed, will catch up with you guys tomorrow. Might not be until the evening after work.

@TED - never said there might be a mafia detective. I said mafia roleblocker.

 

I want to hear from kazio and ccabal. Your thoughts?

@TED - never said there might be a mafia detective. I said mafia roleblocker.

 

I want to hear from kazio and ccabal. Your thoughts?

 

I believe that AKCPLUTO Is lying that he's some "Plane Jane Vanilla townie"

He just copied it from TED with his possible "flavor text" included

and I think the roles are unique (whether positive,

negative or possible a plain townie).

That's why each night, all the ones that are killed have some sort of power.

I also think that it's too convenient for him to have that many excuses to be inactive.

@ccabal86 - whom do you suspect and why?

I will most likely place my vote on AKC or TED.

 

Both claimed to be vanilla townies. We have seen that we the town has a big number of bigger and smaller roles, I find it unlikely that more than 1 vanilla townies exist. AKC has also been a lurker this game, which adds to my suspicion.

 

If I had to vote now, it would be for AKC.

Vote: AKCPLUTO

 

I don't believe his "plane jane" vanilla role claim.

And he didn't vote on Kasabian at all.

If any townie is unsure on how to vote...perhaps the best course would be to no-lynch.

We'd be less one townie but we'd be less one suspect as well.

Cuz right now...if we lynch townie...it's most likely game over.

Just a thought.

I think it's scummy on CD's part to argue for a no-lynch insofar as we, the town, cannot afford to give up a townie right now. I would much rather take a chance on voting. I believe that Kaziocore is the likeliest person to be scum at this point. Therefore, my vote against Kaziocore stands.

I think it's scummy on CD's part to argue for a no-lynch insofar as we, the town, cannot afford to give up a townie right now. I would much rather take a chance on voting. I believe that Kaziocore is the likeliest person to be scum at this point. Therefore, my vote against Kaziocore stands.

 

Not really, we would still gain a day. Anyway, you didn't do much to alleviate my suspicion

 

Vote: AKCPLUTO

I think it's scummy on CD's part to argue for a no-lynch insofar as we, the town, cannot afford to give up a townie right now. I would much rather take a chance on voting. I believe that Kaziocore is the likeliest person to be scum at this point. Therefore, my vote against Kaziocore stands.

 

How can it be scummy?

 

There are 6 players left.

AKCPLUTO

CD

Preston

ccabal86

TED

Kaziocore

 

If we go with no lynch and a townie is night killed...then we'd be left with 5 players.

Then it's a lynch or lose situation again but with one less suspect.

We would be back in the same situation we are right now.

The wildcard is what powers the townies have left to counter the nightkill.

 

It's not an entirely bad play if townies are not sure of their votes.

 

VOTE COUNT

AKCPLUTO (2): CanucksDynasty, ccabal86

Kaziocore (1): AKCPLUTO

 

Not Voting (3): Kaziocore, Preston, Tactical Evil Dan

 

With 6 Alive, 4 is needed to lynch.

Edited March 9, 201115 yr by molestargazer

Vote: AKCPLUTO

 

I don't believe his "plane jane" vanilla role claim.

And he didn't vote on Kasabian at all.

 

If any townie is unsure on how to vote...perhaps the best course would be to no-lynch.

We'd be less one townie but we'd be less one suspect as well.

Cuz right now...if we lynch townie...it's most likely game over.

Just a thought.

 

I think it's scummy on CD's part to argue for a no-lynch insofar as we, the town, cannot afford to give up a townie right now. I would much rather take a chance on voting. I believe that Kaziocore is the likeliest person to be scum at this point. Therefore, my vote against Kaziocore stands.

 

Huh. When it was EM you were kinda gung-ho CD. I dont know how exactly I react to your 'no-lynch' concept and your lessened push for your current target.

 

Numerically I get the idea; right now it's 6 alive/4 to lynch: 4 town/2 mafia. If we reach 2 town/2 mafia, mafia wins. If we no-lynch today, we're reduced to 3 town/2 mafia due to the night kill but have better odds tomorrow. If we lynch today and FAIL, we lose. No-lynching buys us another day, in theory at least. HOWEVER, I strongly doubt that scum would tip their hand by killing someone under consideration, so in the long run I don't really think this will help us.

 

You're somewhat making me re-examine you CD - that suggestion doesnt really seem in the town's best interest. However there's enough for you otherwise that I dont seriously consider you a valid target.

 

-Preston

Unofficial Vote Count

 

Kaziocore (1) - AKCPLUTO (although his vote was partially bolded...not sure if that counts or not)

AKCPLUTO (1) - CanucksDynasty

 

Not Voting (4) - Tactical Evil Dan, ccabal86, Preston, Kaziocore

Huh. When it was EM you were kinda gung-ho CD. I dont know how exactly I react to your 'no-lynch' concept and your lessened push for your current target.

 

Numerically I get the idea; right now it's 6 alive/4 to lynch: 4 town/2 mafia. If we reach 2 town/2 mafia, mafia wins. If we no-lynch today, we're reduced to 3 town/2 mafia due to the night kill but have better odds tomorrow. If we lynch today and FAIL, we lose. No-lynching buys us another day, in theory at least. HOWEVER, I strongly doubt that scum would tip their hand by killing someone under consideration, so in the long run I don't really think this will help us.

 

You're somewhat making me re-examine you CD - that suggestion doesnt really seem in the town's best interest. However there's enough for you otherwise that I dont seriously consider you a valid target.

 

-Preston

Huh. When it was EM you were kinda gung-ho CD. I dont know how exactly I react to your 'no-lynch' concept and your lessened push for your current target.

 

Numerically I get the idea; right now it's 6 alive/4 to lynch: 4 town/2 mafia. If we reach 2 town/2 mafia, mafia wins. If we no-lynch today, we're reduced to 3 town/2 mafia due to the night kill but have better odds tomorrow. If we lynch today and FAIL, we lose. No-lynching buys us another day, in theory at least. HOWEVER, I strongly doubt that scum would tip their hand by killing someone under consideration, so in the long run I don't really think this will help us.

 

You're somewhat making me re-examine you CD - that suggestion doesnt really seem in the town's best interest. However there's enough for you otherwise that I dont seriously consider you a valid target.

 

-Preston

 

 

Let's try that again...

 

 

I put the no-lynch suggestion in case townies didn't know how to vote.

I was thinking about possibly having better odds at lynching mafia with one less suspect.

 

 

Another wild card is if mafia can do an extra nightkill (but I don't think so).

 

 

I think AKCPLUTO is mafia so my vote goes there.